Natasha Nazerali In Defense of German New Medicine

Speaker A 00:00:00.320 - 00:00:02.640 Coming up in this episode, we are. Speaker B 00:00:02.800 - 00:00:27.600 Holding virologists to the gold standard and saying, you have not proved this. We are going up a billion dollar industry that is setting the rules of how we should live and abide by that is literally directly impacting our life. We should be holding Gurman as to the same standard as well, but we're not trying to shove it down anybody's throats. You are now listening to the Here. Speaker A 00:00:27.600 - 00:00:31.840 For the Truth podcast hosted by Joel Rafidi and your. Speaker C 00:00:35.180 - 00:01:15.160 What's up everybody? Welcome back to the Here for the Truth podcast. I'm Joel Raidi, got my co host Rasmos with me as always. Today we have Natasha Nazar Ali rejoining us again with a focus on the conversation of German new medicine, ghk. This kind of system of understanding one's biology which we've spoken about now since 2022. And I guess there's been some questions coming into the fray by certain individuals and certain commenters and we basically just kind of wanted to get on here, bringing attacher on board who's been raised with this knowledge and I guess address some of those claims or potential misinterpretations that are being made about Germany medicine. Speaker A 00:01:15.480 - 00:02:00.010 Yeah. And hopefully we did it justice. I'm sure there might be some people listening that said, oh, there, there's certain things that we could have covered or, or we did cover certain things well, but in a 90 minute conversation, you know, we did the best that we could. But like we said at the end, let's keep the discussion going, let's keep the conversation going. But ultimately with this kind of work, it's on you, the individual, your perception, how you experience the world and how this knowledge and this wisdom applies to your life. And ultimately we want to put the power back into your hands and not, you know, and have you or any of us outsource our power like our bodies are our own. And so the more knowledge, the more wisdom that we can get and understanding how they function is only going to be of benefit. Speaker C 00:02:00.250 - 00:03:32.000 Yeah, absolutely. If you're brand new to this podcast, this might be a bit of a niche conversation and we definitely do recommend that you check out our previous episodes on Germany Medicine, all those you can find by heading to our website, searching for Dr. Melissa Sell or Natasha Nazar Ali and they will definitely come up. But all that being said, we just want to say that as always, we just appreciate your listenership, we appreciate you taking time out of your day to hang out with us and to take in this information. We wish you all nothing but the best, most fruitful life imaginable. And we consider it our job to continue to provide conversations, resources, community and knowledge to help you upon that path of becoming who you were uniquely born to be. So please enjoy. We are welcoming back Natasha Natsarrali, a GNM practitioner and educator who guides individuals to awaken their true power through spiritual and biological connections. Inspired by her holistic upbringing and the teaching of Dr. Harmer's five biological laws, Natasha is dedicated to helping others achieve total sovereignty and freedom over their health. Through her work in biological relating, Natasha has realized the power of our ancestral lineage. And by incorporating family systems in her work, it has helped bring more harmony and reconnect individuals with their divine nature. Natasha was here just recently with episode 258, the Heroine's Journey, and previous to that, episode 223 with Dr. Melissa Sell discussing the Biological Woman. Two absolutely amazing episodes which I definitely recommend people check out. Speaker A 00:03:32.880 - 00:05:07.040 Well, yeah, and we wanted to bring Natasha on because, you know, it's interesting. In the last several years as, as gnm, ghk, Germanic, however you pronounce it, has been getting, you know, more popular and people have been seeing the value of this knowledge that has really been impacting their life. What usually happens when new things come into, I say, like the, the sphere of, of understanding is people want to challenge it, people want to pick it apart. And I'm all for challenging things and I'm all for picking it apart. And our dear friend Melissa was recently on the Way Forward podcast with Alex z with about 4 hour and 45 minute conversation or something like that. And I was really excited about that because Alex, a dear friend, we've had conversations about Dr. Hamer's work and he has a big audience and I wanted more people to have exposure to this knowledge that has had a huge impact on my life. But since that episode came out, there have been some individuals who have been, you know, challenging elements of it. And so we wanted to come on here and bring Natasha on to share thoughts on the things that have been challenged and some of the videos that have been put out. And Natasha is unique in the regard that she grew up with this knowledge. She is German, you know, her mom was involved with this work. And so I'm really looking forward to this conversation. Thank you so much for coming on. Thanks for being the fierce advocate for truth that you are. And so I guess I'll leave it to you. Like, where would you like to begin with this conversation? Speaker B 00:05:08.030 - 00:07:29.100 Yeah, thank you for having me. First of all, by the way, it's always nice to be back again. But one thing that's been sort of so interesting for me to witness is just German medicine, or Germanische Heilkunde, which was what Dr. Hamer originally named it as, is just coming to the forefront. And it's gaining such popularity. And for someone like me who's been raised on this work, who's been seeing the evolution of this work over since the 80s, right. But for me, I'm much younger than that. I was not born in the 80s. So over the span of around 20 years, just to watch how this has grown and come to the forefront is truly incredible. But as it comes to the forefront and people pick it up and people start sharing it, you know, things do get misinterpreted or things get lost in translation. And so it is really the responsibility of, you know, us educators of integrity to make sure that we're sharing this wisdom, this really beautiful, eternal, sacred wisdom with as much honesty and integrity as possible. And so there's a lot of misconceptions that go around about anything as soon as it starts to become popular. Right. So it's to no one's fault, really. It's more just of the newness of this now being so widely embraced. And it's a funny sort of paradox that we as educators who have been in this for a while, you know, we're trying to navigate, we're on one hand, so wildly excited about this work gaining such huge momentum, and at the other side, we want to make sure that we're still maintaining the sanctity of it. And, you know, like, no publicity is bad publicity as it's coming to the forefront. There will also be people who want to contradict the work or who might misunderstand it or misrepresent it or who might question it. And, you know, we're here for the truth. So we have, like, the total welcoming. We're welcoming that really, in Germany, medicine, we truly are. But I have to say, like, it's one of those things that's made me a little sad because it's trendy for everyone else. But for us, especially in Europe, you know, this has been wild, widely embraced by for quite some time. So it's nothing new for us, but it's new for everybody else. Speaker A 00:07:29.660 - 00:09:24.110 Well, I think it's also interesting to note, too, that anytime you have, let's say, someone who's a pioneer, you have the first generation of people who learn something, like side by side with the person who developed something, and then you have other generations, the following generations. And then you have those people that want to just take something that someone else created and then pawn it off at their, as their own or combine it with something else and then not even give credit to it. So I think like there, there can be a watering down process that happens with innovation. And on top of that there is the language barrier too. You have the foundational, the mother tongue of this body of work is German. And so then you're also dealing with different translations and how people interpret those translations and how that kind of impacts the knowledge getting out there. But yeah, I think the, the, I think the first thing I'm just going to like, say it, you know, there, there, there's someone out there in the world. His name's Daniel Roytas. He's a, he's someone who I do respect. He's written an amazing book challenging germ theory and, and contagion. But it seems like, you know, GNM has been something that he's wanted to really challenge from like an empirical scientific standpoint. And after the episode with Melissa came out with Alec, you know, he kind of came on and he did a video. For some reason his videos that he did on, on this aren't on his Facebook page anymore, so I'm not sure why that is. But he pretty much said the four and a half hour conversation was pretty underwhelming. And then he went on to kind of offer his critiques and then some of those critiques. I mean, I get it, you know, he, he's been bringing up this idea that like, you can't really get to 100% empirical truth in the life sciences because there's things that you cannot control for. And of course in G and M, you know, you, you can't leave consciousness at the door. We're literally saying your psyche perception impacts adaptation in the body. So how can you really measure that to some degree? So with that as the kind of starting point, I'd love for you to comment on that. Speaker B 00:09:25.550 - 00:10:25.200 Yeah, well, first of all, I think that there are some misinterpretations of the claims that we are actually making through Germana. So I know that, you know, people watch the podcast or they might listen to something and then they might say, wow, you know, German medicine is making really exorbitant claims on biology, that they know all the answers, that this is the ultimate biological framework. But actually when you get down and you understand this wisdom very well and you've integrated it into your lifestyle, I, those aren't really the claims that we're really making are that human and nature are one and that we are living in constant alignment with that. And that there are biological framework is designed in our primal essence. So we're very primal natural beings constantly adapting to the experiences we are going through. And it's a very good point. Speaker A 00:10:25.200 - 00:10:25.480 Right. Speaker B 00:10:25.480 - 00:12:19.530 Because that first biological law that we have, every symptom in the body, begins with a conflict shock. How do we codify the psyche? You know, we know well enough now that consciousness does not come from the brain. So I don't think that there's anybody out there on this earth plane that could prove that psyche and what consciousness is, but we do know that it is there. Right. So this is the. The first biological law that the psyche, our consciousness, is constantly in this human extinct experience. Yeah. And going to adapt and have this moment when there is this primal conflict shock, this sudden, unexpected, acute dramatic event. Yeah. And we are seeing at the level of the brain an adaptation at this very moment. Right. We have this hummer foci, this ring formation. And then consequently, we are seeing a manifestation of symptoms in the body. So we see tissue adaptation. Right. And that's the main claim. And it is difficult if someone's going to say to us, well, how can you explain and codify that the psyche is doing this when. When there is no way that we can actually pinpoint what the psyche is scientifically because it's a. You know, it's a. It's a conscious, living ex. Experience. So that's one of the things. And nobody in German new medicine is claiming that. Nobody in Germane kunde is claiming that we have the ability to codify the psyche because the psyche is who we are. It's beyond the body, but it is in synchronicity with the body. It is one and the same. Would you agree? Speaker A 00:12:19.930 - 00:12:20.730 Yeah, I agree. Speaker B 00:12:21.610 - 00:13:49.930 Yeah. And so if we know that consciousness doesn't come from the brain and it comes from beyond, then that is what we are, meaning the psyche to be. The. The me, the I that I am that is experiencing the world, experiencing nature in my physical vessel, in my body. Yeah. And now the next things we're claiming is that there is biological law. Okay. So through the lens of Ghrman as it's like, it's not even through the lens of Grimna Shah Khanda. It's through the lens, through the lens of nature in its supreme being. There are fundamental biological laws. So there is the law that every living being is born through a mother. There is the biological law that we have male and female, there is biological law that we have, the sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous system. Like, that is real, measurable biological law. Right. Like a spiritual sperm has to come into the egg and fertilize it to create life. So we can widely accept that there are biological laws, and that is one of the claims that we are making. Yeah. And if you think about it, it just makes perfect logistical sense that there would be biological law and that nature and our biology would live in harmony with that. Right. Speaker A 00:13:51.310 - 00:13:52.910 I feel you. I feel what you're saying. Speaker B 00:13:53.630 - 00:16:18.130 Yeah. And so the next biological law, the third biological law after the two phases, would be embryology. So it is measurable how we are forming in the womb and the different brain areas that are responsible for different functions in the body. So, you know, this learning about the different tissues and how they work and how they adapt is very important into understanding how our biology works. So that is following the embryological order. And of course, we can follow that. Now we do have the technology to be able to see how a living organism is growing in embryo. Right. So we do know. And for example, when we're looking at someone who is experiencing a symptom that they're born with, we can backtrack that on the timeline by seeing, okay, if this is the. If this is the sort of interim in gestation when this specific organ is growing, and therefore this person was born with adaptation, we can backtrack to see when that would have occurred in utero. Yeah. So we have the ability to look at a living being from the whole. From the bird's eye view in this perspective. And then, you know, the one that I know everyone for sure would agree with would be the law of microbes. Right. So we know this already, that a virus has never been isolated and that bacteria, fungi in our microbes are helpers and are there for us. Okay. Interestingly enough, there have been many studies conducted on how our microbiome shifts when exposed to a toxin. So even, you know, fish in very polluted environments will. Will alter their microbiomes or, you know, know, bacteria found in Chernobyl is. Is operating at a different way, is growing more and more bacteria to better break down more toxic exposure. Okay. So even the fourth biological law, when it comes to toxins is playing a very significant role. And then the fifth biological law is our quintessence. Yeah. That is the most important one, that nothing is random or meaningless in the body. So, no, we are not victims to nature. Quite the opposite. We are one with nature. And so we're working in harmony with it, not never a victim to it. Speaker A 00:16:19.010 - 00:17:05.790 So thank you for all that. Obviously, there's a lot to unpack there. But I kind of want to go into this other thing that was posted by Daniel. He made a post, and I think this was after he watched a webinar that was done by the Bigglesons with Mark Pfister. And so, again, the Bigglesens have been promoting Dr. Dr. Hummer's work. I love the Bagelsons with Adam on the podcast. Their work with holographic blood is amazing. But they brought on Mark Pfister, someone who I believe he used to work with Dr. Hammer in the past. And Daniel had posted a few weeks ago that not even Hammer wanted anything to do with German new medicine. He said, how telling. And so interesting that he would say that. And I'm curious for you to maybe elaborate on that. Speaker B 00:17:06.750 - 00:18:45.360 Yeah, absolutely. So when you've been in this work a while, you understand that there is a. As a political environment that has come with this work, and it has caused a lot of controversy and it sometimes causes some drama. And of course, Mark is also a German speaker, so get a little bit lost in translation. But really what's going on is that German new medicine is what it's known as in our Western mainstream media world, but Dr. Hamer named it Germanische Heidelpunde, Germanic Healing Knowledge. And as he was bringing this work out to the forefront and people were learning and studying with him and wanting to bring it to the west, is when they sort of started renaming everything or having their own communities or teaching it. And this is where it gets a little bit tricky as a pioneer, like you mentioned, because how do we. How do we control this or how do we oversee this, or how do we maintain the integrity of it? You know, especially because we don't want to just abide by the Western medical establishment, which would say that you need to be certified, you need to have a specific education, you need to study with certain people, right? Because really, Dr. Hamer believed that it was your birthright to know this work, and he wanted this work to be accessible to anyone and everyone who wanted to learn. So if he now would have said, oh, you have to have a certification, you have to have this, then we would be falling into that sort of same arena that we're really trying to get away from, right? We're really wanting to achieve total sovereignty. Speaker A 00:18:45.920 - 00:19:28.920 So therefore, real quick, real quickly, I just want to. I want to just check in. So when he first came up with these discoveries, I Guess in the early 80s. Like when did he decide to call what he created, what he discovered something like, like, I know it's hard to say German new new medicine when we're looking at 40, 50 years ago. So like, did he. What was the initial name in German? Was it Germanische Haukunde in German initially and then like even the American, I guess, translation of German new Medicine or Germanic new Medicine, that he wanted to move away from that because of association with the word medicine and even the fact that like, at some point it was no longer new. Speaker B 00:19:30.760 - 00:21:03.340 Correct. So pretty much what happened was that when he was codifying the work, he named it Germana she hail Kunde in homage to his ancestors in trying to highlight that this was ancestral wisdom, that this was the wisdom of nature. He was also a huge, you know, philosophy guy into theos, theosophy, theology, studying ancient religions, ancient texts. And he became a really big fan of studying Sanskrit and the runes and you know, how his ancestors, the Germanic people, would have been pagans. And so he even, you know, talked a lot about the God Vodom, this sort of the father of all fathers, this God of nature, this fatherly force of, of nature that is the wisdom keeper, that has all the knowledge of all living beings. And, and from there, from his sort of. Yeah, you could say from his embodiment, from his point of view of his discovery of this work, Germanic Hayekunde was what he named it, Germanic healing knowledge. And one of the things he was very worried about was that other people would go and take this framework and maybe create their own spin off or their own modality with it and rename it. Yeah. And so one of his sort of, you can say, yeah, one of his sort of hang ups and things that he was struggling with at the time was this idea that it was being brought to the west. And now it's German new medicine. And now people are gnmers. Speaker C 00:21:03.340 - 00:21:03.780 Yeah. Speaker B 00:21:04.020 - 00:23:30.620 And they're wanting to study it a certain way, um, work with it a certain way. Right. And that's the other thing. This is biological framework. So this is the map of your body, but it is not a cure or it is not a method or a modality for healing. So how one practitioner works within the framework is going to be very unique to them. And all of this to say that it was very difficult for him to oversee all this. And mind you, at the time, Erasmus, he was also exiled, so he's also trying to deliver this information. He's, you know, some of some people I know who know him they could vouch for his own paranoia that was going on at the time of, you know, his fear that people were out, out to get him or out to take his information or maybe out to harm him. So that also created a lot of his own. You could say, you know, he was consolated behavior. Yeah, he was, he was very, he was a very strong willed man. You know, many people who worked with him would, would agree to his, his strong will and his stubbornness around the way in which he wanted this knowledge to be brought forth. And one of them was definitely the name. He wanted it to be Vermont. And he didn't want anybody to be taking that name and now taking the work and doing something else. So the phrase, the statement not even Dr. Hamer wanted anything to do with German New Medicine, from my point of view, would be accurate, although it's being misinterpreted currently. But yes, of course it would be accurate. And of course there are, this is very well known within the community that there are educators who are very purist, who are very strict, who are wanting the work to be conveyed a certain way, and other people want to make sure that they're not necessarily aligning with those educators. And that's where these little bubbles form. And if I, if I am believing correctly in the terrain theory world, this is also going on. I have also heard that in the terrain theory world, you know, there are certain research being conducted on viruses and who can say what and who has the authority to speak on it, and who's controlled opposition. Right. Like, we see this worldwide. So technically the statement is true. It's just being currently misinterpreted. Speaker A 00:23:31.100 - 00:24:15.110 What, what, so what did Mark Pfister say? And like, what was your experience of that webinar? Like, what did you, what do you, what did you get from that? Like, what did you agree with? What did you think was misinterpreted from his point of view? Because again, here we are, we know there are people out there that love to talk about logical fallacies. And yet, you know, here's one person that has some experience in this work and has worked with Hummer. And then if he says something that aligns with your cognitive bias, then you start throwing that out there, which is an appeal to authority, logical fallacy as opposed to looking at things from a much more holistic standpoint and realizing that there are many people that are involved with this work, there are many people that have worked with Hummer, there are many people that are in this lineage of taking this knowledge and applying it to their life and with their work with people. Speaker B 00:24:16.570 - 00:27:27.140 Well, first of all, I think what the Bigglesons are doing is fantastic. And even when I first met them at Music in Sky years ago, in their presentation, they honored Dr. Hamer, and when they were telling the story of their father, they mentioned how. How inspired their father was by Dr. Hamer. So I think, you know, ultimately the first thing I felt when I was on the webinar was just an immense amount of gratitude toward them for sharing this work and for using their own platform to bring on someone who worked alongside Dr. Hamer. I think it's phenomenal. And I think that their own work is only more helpful to Germana Kunda, because of course, for these things at the brain level, we should absolutely be able to see it in different areas of the body, like the blood. Right? Because what they're, what they're showing with the holographic blood, they're also showing the correlation between how the blood is looking like and then the physical symptoms that the person is experiencing. So I just want to start off with that. And then Mark Pfister, you know, working directly alongside Harmer, he was telling amazing stories during the call about how they were putting out all the books about embryology and creating the laws and going through it. So I'm certain he's a wealth of information and I also have many colleagues who have studied directly underneath him and, and through him. Just having to be like a trailblazer and talk about this for so many years and risk his own reputation, risk his own, you know, life, you could say to get this wisdom out there is incredibly noble. So that already goes to show his own integrity. And I can imagine he has faced immense adversity as he's been speaking out against this. Right. And speaking out about this work. So for him, he is, you know, he was very much defending a lot of the work and also he was defending his positions on what he doesn't agree with within the German medicine community. And that's really, really important to note. So one of the things that he was talking about is how a lot of the purest gnomers in Europe are not working alongside the medical establishment when necessary. And so it is true that there are certain symptoms, there are certain biological adaptations where medical intervention would be helpful, if not life saving. And so other educators and practitioners who might be out there in the world, who are very holistic and very set in their ways, who don't embrace that, who don't embrace that synergy, could be very detrimental to patients. And he was Pointing that out. You know, he was. He was making a point to say that that can be very dangerous. And luckily, with the educators that I've worked with, we have always made it our mission to work in tandem with medical intervention when needed. And this is the way Dr. Hamer intended the biological framework to be used, because, remember, he thought it would really be embraced by the medical society, and it wasn't. So on those points that Mark was pointing out, I definitely agreed with it. Speaker A 00:27:28.420 - 00:27:31.780 Yeah. Are there people out there that have issues with the Fifth Biological Law? Speaker B 00:27:32.740 - 00:31:08.320 Yeah, so that's another good point. So another thing Mark had mentioned was that the fifth Biological Law, the quintessence, is something that was brought upon later. And that is also true. So if you look at the texts that Hammer wrote earlier, they don't include the Fifth Biological Law. And that is something that was added later on as the quintessence. You know, it's a. It's a general understanding of nature and life itself. So within this biological framework, what this framework is, is biology, bio life, and mogos, the study of it. So that is what we are truthfully doing in Germana is we are embarking upon the study of life, wanting to go deeper and deeper and deeper into it. So one of the things that Mark was saying is that how do we prove this fifth biological lies? He was. He was kind of mentioning that, oh, Hammer was so spiritual and Hammer was so airy fairy, that, oh, it all sounds good for everything in the body to have a meaning and a biological function. But can we actually prove that? And I think we absolutely can, because that has to be. That has to be our common ground of the understanding of nature itself, that nothing is random, that nothing is good, nothing is bad. Everything has a purpose, everything has a function. And he had a little tidbit there, Mark, about how when he's looking at the old brain, he can prove this more easily. Like, for example, if you're looking at the old brain, the ovaries would be an organ that is controlled by the old brain. So the ovaries is a loss conflict, Right. The loss of a loved one, the loss of a child, a miscarriage, an abortion, the loss of the baby I thought I was going to have. And when I experienced this loss conflict as a female, I have cellular proliferation. I am increasing my progesterone, my estrogen, so I can better attract mate. Right. And that is what the organ is responsible for, for procreation. So he said, oh, yeah, when it comes to the old brain, I can very easily show you the biological function of those symptoms. But when it's coming to the new brain, the more advanced area, those are, those are things like the coronary arteries, the cervix, the coronary veins. There's many different organs that are residing in the new brain. He has a harder time being so accurate. And this is the most advanced area of the brain that is responsible for communication. But now remember, constellations also reside in the most advanced area of the brain, in the cortex, in the temporal lobe. And remember, constellation is now when we have a conflict on each side of the brain. So in each brain hemisphere we have conflict load, we go into a constellation. And now instead of having adaptation at the physical level, I have a behavioral change. And the behavioral change is also for a reason. Right. I can also prove that a change in behavior, like a psychosis is the result of a conflict and is there for a reason to solve my problem. So. So I think it's more a discrepancy of what we're actually claiming the five biological law is. Speaker A 00:31:09.200 - 00:34:21.260 Well, yeah, and also too, when you talk about how Pfister was like, oh, I can show more with the old brain, but Even from a 100% empirical proof standpoint, how, you know, how do you show that the loss is causing the DHS, like these people that are challenging the 100% scientific claim of G and M, you're not going to be able to show that. So then at some point you have to go, okay, well, if we can't show 100% empirical proof with these life sciences, then what's next? Do we look at phenomenology? Do we look at, you know, outcomes? Do we look at patterns? And then do we move more towards what makes most sense and what seems most true? If we can't get to that pure 100% truth, you know, because again, if we're gonna, if we're gonna start with this foundation that like there's certain things that just can't be known 100%, then we have to apply that to the other arguments that are coming from the terrain community where they go, toxins are the cause of disease, or they pay lip service and they say, oh or emotional stress or something of that nature, you know, like they'll throw that in there. But it doesn't seem very specific. It actually seems less scientific, and I say scientific in quotes than what I think GNM is putting forth. On top of the fact that many in the terrain community, I don't want to say all they will throw, they will stamp the detox label on every single symptom that. That occurs on the body. And so I've had this conversation with other people that would consider them terrain, you know, like in the terrain camp. And I go, well, doesn't that seem pretty unscientific now? I'm not trying to reverse the burden of proof. You know, I'm just trying to say, hey, if we can agree that there are things that are difficult to truly know, then where do we start from? And saying it's detox season or you're detoxing, you're detoxing, like, you know, that just. That seems very vague in general to me. Like, so I. I almost want to, like, bring these two camps, and I hate even separating them in camps. But you have people that are more aligned with Germanicia, Hakunde, and then more people that are aligned, you know, in the terrain world, but coming at it from a different angle and go, well, can you explain to me why one person, you know, gets a sore on their lip versus a rash on the inside of their arms or a rash on the outside of their arms and some other symptom in the body? Like, what is your explanation for the specificity of symptom manifestation? And let's put forth what your thoughts are. You know, GNM has their views on the specificity. So I think that's also something that really kind of gets under my skin, is that you have people out there, like, banging the drums. You can't prove gm. They're making these claims. They're making these claims, okay, cool. We're stating what we think is closest to truth. But then again, like, what's your position? You know, how accurate is your position? How scientific is your position? And so again, like, then where do we go from? You know, like, it'd be nice if Dr. Hammer's work could have billions of dollars of funding into it. Like, you know, other realms of medicine, whether it's conventional, alternative has. So anyways, this is just things that are kind of going on in my mind when I think about, you know, these. These debates that happen on a regular basis. Speaker B 00:34:22.140 - 00:39:30.420 Right? And then, you know, there's the argument that the. The burden of proof does not, you know, lie upon the person who's saying it. Right? With the toxic thing, it's like, okay, well, I don't have the burden of proof now to show you it's toxin just because I'm saying it's not what you're saying, right? So, you know, playing devil's advocate there, one might say, one might talk about the Burden of proof. But I think what. What I'm trying to highlight here is that the claims that are actually being made by everyone in the framework is that we have these five biological laws that we are in tandem with, that our biology is living in alignment with. And then what we have done is we have discovered that there is direct correlation between the psyche, the brain, and the organ through the CT scans. So this is not an artifact, it's not a phenomenon. It is something that we are seeing, that we are able to replicate through person after person after person. So one of the main methods that we are using in our claim is case study. So case study means that I am looking at a person who has a symptom, who has a diagnosis, who is experiencing an actual adaptation at the level of the organ that I can measure. And then as I am measuring that adaptation at the organ level, I am looking to see whether I can notice a correlation between the brain and the organ. So when I'm looking at the CT scan, I'm using a CT scan, no contrast, and I'm seeing a target ring formation. And this came up also in Mark's call that didn't get the chance to be explained. So I'm happy to explain it. Now, this hummer foci and target ring formation is water. So we have an edema that is forming in the brain. And that edema is the swelling. Yeah. And this is what is creating the ring. So when I am looking at a CT scan, it's almost as though I'm looking at a map. I am observing how faint or how sharp the hammer foci is so that I can understand whether this conflict has been active and active for some time, how intense it is, or whether this conflict is already in the solving or whether it's in the relapsing, meaning I'm re triggering the same conflict over and over and over again. And this looks different. So, you know, when I had my CT scan read, I could see it. One major separation conflict, very active in the sensory cortex. Yeah. And it's constantly relapsing. That hamer foci, that ring of water looked very different than, for example, the cyst I had in my left ovary. Yeah. So that foci was from five years ago. And in the ovaries, that specific tissue does not break down, so that ovarian cyst will stay. And this is how we can better understand the correlation between the brain and the organization. And that is the claim that we are actually making. So when we observe a case study, we are able to say, okay, this symptom appeared here. Not only that, but what the timeline of the symptom is. And then we often go back and follow up years later, months later, depending on the symptom, we will go back and conduct another CT scan and another CT scan. And you know, Dr. Stefan Lanka is doing amazing work with some other educators and some other practitioners who are to try and get a program that will be able to read the CT scan for anybody who wants to. Because theoretically, this is just a pattern and it should be able to be read even by AI or by a computer. And therefore it's completely codified. And our claim that we're making is that this always matches up to the patient, so we are always able to see organ adaptation and brain adaptation. And so think about it like the work of Veda Austin, where it's like, I'm observing water. I am noticing a change in the water through my psyche, through my conscious intent. Right. So this is the. The idea that we can't prove the psyche, that the consciousness is stemming from something beyond my own biology, beyond the brain. But it is absolutely working synergistically with my brain. And so Veda Austin's work is like, what is she doing? She's studying the language of water. Incredible. What are the Bigglestons doing? What's our blood is water. They're also studying the map of water. What are we doing with the CT scans? We're noticing water. And theoretically, maybe if. If somebody else were to come, we should be able to see it, maybe even at the brain waves. You know, Hammer was getting into that later on. He was studying the frequency of sound and how it harmonizes brain patterns and what changes and shifts are happening at the brain level when we incorporate frequency and sound. Yeah, that's what he wants to evolve to. Speaker A 00:39:30.740 - 00:40:25.730 Yeah, no, that totally land lands and it resonates. And it just seems like people are so stuck on. And I get it to some degree that like, well, you can prove that this ring is caused by whatever, you know, like getting broken up with in a relationship or losing your job or your house burning down, you know, and it's just like, I. I don't. I don't know if there are the gnomers out there that are making that claim that it is. It's 100 scientific in in that regards. So. Yeah. Anyways, I mean, it's just. It just seems rational to me, like what we're talking about, if we're using all our senses, if we're making observations, if we're There has to be the subjective within this as well. Like our life, our consciousness, what we go through, like that plays a role. And I could share some of my stories later. I'm sure you can too, about things that make sense based on but else's point of view. Speaker B 00:40:26.050 - 00:42:08.230 To be fair, we as a collective, you know, us truthers, radicals, I don't know, whatever you want to call us. Yeah, we are holding, you know, the virologist to the gold standard and saying, hey, you know what? You, you have not proved this. And so I understand the notion to look at us and say, oh, we were making all these claims. If, if we are holding these powers that be accountable for virology and for, you know, everything that they're shoving down our throats, we should be holding Gurman to the same standard as well. And what I want to just make an emphasis on is that we are welcoming more research. We would, we would enjoy that. We want more people to learn this wisdom and get into it and maybe come up with other conclusions or other ways of verifying this. No one is against that, but let us remember that we are going up an industry, a billion dollar industry that is setting the governance of our societies, the rules of how we should live and abide by that is literally directing, directly impacting our life. Yeah. And they have not been able to prove it with billions and billions of dollars of funding. That is very different than saying, you know, to our biological framework. That we're not trying to convince anyone. Actually, Mark Pfister beautifully said this in the webinar. He's like, I don't need to convince anyone that if you discovered this wisdom and you're open to it and you would like to learn it and get on board with it and live your life in alignment with that, then amazing. But it's not for us to. We're not trying to shove it down anybody's throats. Maybe if you're my mother, you are. Speaker A 00:42:08.470 - 00:43:20.000 Well, no, but this is the thing. It's like that's the way I look at it too. It's like I came across this information when I first Met Melissa in 2020 and it landed for me and it made sense. And so I don't really need to get into back and forth arguments that I witness online, that I seen common threads, I don't really care. That said, Joel and I, we have a podcast. It's called Here for the Truth. This is a subject that's near and dear to my heart. And I want at least our audience or people that are Interested to be able to, you know, hear different points of view related to what's going on. But again, it's like, I'm grateful that, like, I've deepened my connection to nature, my. My role in nature, and to see how this stuff makes sense and has lessened my fear of things happening in my body. That is game changing to me. And so, yeah, I mean, I. I just love that element of it that, you know, this knowledge ultimately is for everyone, whether or not you can prove it 100% or not. Like, if it lands, it lands. If it doesn't, it doesn't. I don't. Again, I don't need to just prove everyone wrong. It's that you have to believe this stuff, like, learn it to the best of your ability and see if it applies to your life and then go from there. Yeah. Speaker B 00:43:20.000 - 00:43:22.640 And that ultimately comes. Yeah, go ahead, Joel. Speaker C 00:43:22.800 - 00:43:23.680 No, you can go. Speaker B 00:43:24.400 - 00:45:21.600 Yeah. What I was wanting to also express is that ultimately comes down to this illusion that we are separate from nature. And this is truly what Hammer was seeking to create and expand on. A different perspective and a different point of view. That is not new, that is eternal, that all of our ancestors have already known about this. Yeah. And so it's really important that is, that it's expressed, because that is actually the fifth biological law that quintessence is that understanding that we are truly one with nature and we have lost sight of that. And even in the alternative health community, you know, it's like it's also another billion dollar industry. Like, let us not forget that it is, okay, Pushing supplements and wellness things and retreats and et cetera, and we really lost sight of where we truly come from. And so one of the most beautiful things I loved about Hammer was his spirituality and was his connection to wanting to understand. Understand what past civilizations already knew, and wanting this to be really a paradigm of remembrance, you know, and that is so rare and with one of the things that's dear and close to my heart, because I have taken, like, a real fond appreciation into studying different lineages and working with different peoples and nations and cultures to really better understand my own biology. And every time I've worked with them and I tell them about what I do, they just nod and shake their head like, yeah, we, we know this. Like, what you teach makes perfect sense. Speaker C 00:45:22.320 - 00:45:22.720 Yeah. Speaker A 00:45:22.720 - 00:45:45.670 Well, I think even. Even on an alternative level, and even to some degree, like the more allopathic level, I think people kind of get that stress impacts your body, that your emotions impact your body. So I don't Know why this is such a, like, stretch to really delve into it from an even more specific adaptive standpoint. You know what I mean? Speaker C 00:45:46.390 - 00:46:24.030 Yeah. I didn't get the chance to watch Daniel's videos before they were hidden or taken down. But in the past, when observing, you know, GNM detractors or whatnot, it seems that they tend to simplify it into claiming that GNM says that is just emotional trauma that causes disease, but that's not what a DHS is ultimately like. A DHS is unexpected, highly acute, isolating, and yet the argument becomes about like unprocessed emotions or classic psychotherapy, you know, childhood trauma and things of this nature, which I find is like the wrong place to argue against it from. Speaker A 00:46:24.510 - 00:47:48.020 Yeah. And also too, there are individuals out there, you know, that have been challenging gm. You know, there was a webinar by one of these gentlemen that he did a couple years ago, and I was really curious about because he posted it on Facebook and he was like, I'm going to challenge and share this webinar on rethinking emotional trauma. And I was like. And I was like, oh, I'm totally down as someone who comes from the realm of trauma, as a body worker, as a trauma trained practitioner, you know, doing my best to study the nervous system. And so like, I decided to watch it, so if you watched it with me. And it's like he started the presentation with just an archaic definition of trauma where he was pretty much highlighting it's the event that causes this thing. And so all his arguments that came afterward were based on an, an incomplete and archaic definition of trauma, when obviously it's a much more complex, you know, psychological and biological response to events and perception plays a role. And he was talking about perception later on, which aligns with the GNM framework. So that was very community. That was a little confusing to me, especially because during that, that webinar he was throwing, you know, he was challenging, you know, the GNM framework. And so I go, you just started off this whole, let's say, challenge by not really understanding trauma in general. And so that's my personal thought, personal view on it. And so, yeah, please respond to that. Speaker B 00:47:48.020 - 00:48:12.610 And what Joel said, well, it's absolutely true. I mean, that's one of the things that I've always noticed when I listen to anyone is that we actually have so much common ground. Anytime I listen to someone, I'm like, well, actually that's exactly what we're saying. If you were to really know this work, you would Understand that. So there is always more common ground than what we believe there to be. For sure. Speaker A 00:48:13.970 - 00:48:14.450 Yeah. Speaker C 00:48:15.970 - 00:48:46.220 You guys notice at all that it seems to be like there's. There's kind of this energy within, like maybe the podcasting or health influencer kind of sphere, where maybe people have had a certain amount of education, very specific education down a certain line. Whenever, like a G and M argument comes about, or say Daniel Reuters makes one of these posts, there seem to be, like, key people, like, trumping at the bit to kind of bring down GNM with it, in a sense. Speaker A 00:48:46.940 - 00:48:57.410 Well, well, yeah, also too. And like, I mean, this applies not to just this, but, you know, everything else where a belief system or some framework is challenged. Like, there are people that have skin in the game. Speaker C 00:48:57.490 - 00:48:57.850 Yeah. Speaker A 00:48:57.850 - 00:49:26.190 They've built up their careers, they've built up their identities. Their source of their livelihood comes from certain paradigms. And so if another paradigm comes in that challenges the validity or the truth of the paradigm that they've been living under or practicing under, you know, that's. I mean, you're dealing with a level of cognitive dissonance to some degree. And so I get it on some level. So I'm not sure if that's exactly what you're talking about, but I see that. Yeah, yeah. Speaker B 00:49:26.190 - 00:51:11.250 And I think also one of the misunderstandings is also that we cherry pick, you know, so some of the things that people also mention when they're just discovering it, they're like, well, I freaking have conflicts every day. So, like, how do I know? Right. And that's a good observation. They're like, well, you're saying it's this, but, like, if I could pick anything, they say I could pick anything that happened to me, and then that's the reason. But they're forgetting the actual primal nature of it. Right. So it's like, it's. It's that understanding of. No, we're actually looking very specifically at the function of the organ, the timeline in which symptom appeared, and then understanding what it is that you experienced that would make it so that this organization, organ, would be the most beneficial solution to your problem. So when you're actually working with it, when you're working with us as G and M practitioners, that's one of the hoops I already have to overcome when a client is coming in because they're going, oh, I have this. And, oh, yeah, but five years ago, my dad died, and I'm like, okay, that's great. That's not relevant to this symptom. So we actually Never cherry pick. That's actually one of the, one of the sort of circumstances that we have to get over when we're working with someone. Because when someone's just discovering this work, you know, they might say, oh yeah, I'm, I'm, I'm having this, you know, flare up of the skin. But my mother left me when I was 2, it's like, okay, well that might not be the current separation conflict that we're working with right now. So you always start in the now. And we actually try and get as accurate as possible on really defining what the conflict is. Speaker A 00:51:12.130 - 00:52:13.480 I think also too like, you know, this obviously aligns with like what our work is, is about. You know, it's just this idea of cultivating more self knowledge, like knowing yourself on the deepest levels. And like, I can't sit here and say that a lot of people are really committed to understanding the nature of their psyche and what they've gone through and what they've been through. And so like also there are things that are happening on a subconscious level. Like there we just may not have the awareness of what's going on. Just like our biology is doing things all the time that we don't have awareness of. You know, I walk into a dark room, what's happening to my eyes, I see a tiger, what's going on, you know, in my nervous system, like there's things that are happening automatically that I think even when we're looking at things from an adaptive standpoint, like we, we just may not have that awareness. And so how can we cultivate greater awareness of who we are, what we've been through? And of course having this knowledge can support that process to help us connect the dots as best we can. Speaker C 00:52:16.280 - 00:53:02.470 So I'm kind of curious because like I see this a lot like when, when the arguments is coming from the place of, you know, this can't be proven, therefore it shouldn't be solid ground to stand upon. Like what are those commentators like actually advocating for? Are they just advocating that people shouldn't get behind something like Germany medicine because it can't be 100% proven? Like are they proposing something else in its place? But because like, isn't there always a process to get towards more truth and to get closer to truth? And like, even if in the going through that process there might be holes or questions asked in the interim, doesn't it like it almost seems as though they arguing for people not to even try to get to a system that makes sense and that works well. Speaker B 00:53:02.470 - 00:56:02.660 Yeah, and that's Exactly. Like almost cherry picking this one podcast. Right. Like, gosh, how many incredible people talk about incredible forms of modality that or, or even biology that actually correlate with so much of our work and to sort of cherry pick one and demonize one and like, and that's the other thing. It's like when you're on a podcast, you're also doing your thing. You're, you're, you're giving forth your spiel of what it is do and what it is that you practice in your way of being, in your way of life. And yeah, people really seem to have a bone to pick with the gnomers thinking that what we are saying is so exorbitant and so grandiose, but really it's nature. That's what we're saying. So what I truly believe is it's rooted in our own disillusionment of body, of our body body. You know, it's like I'm living here in Costa Rica and we just had New Year's and for the first time in my life celebrating a Gregorian calendar. But this was even beyond that, coming together with community. I was in the jungle, like bare feet, feet in the mud below the stars and the moon. Completely connected, completely taking in the oneness that we are within our whole, not even just our cosmology, but within nature and the living world itself. And we're here and we're singing together and you know, the music is playing and it is a really, not only just a spiritual experience, but is a, it is a biological experience to understand what it feels like to actually be in nature. And it's really easy to talk the talk. Yeah. Like we do, but it's a totally different thing to actually walk the walk. How often do we do that? Like how often do we actually get and gather together with our tribes and listen to our elders and come together and listen to the trees and be seen by the trees and sure, like you know these certain people saying, oh, that's all airy fairy stuff, but it's not. It is who we actually are. And this biological framework is a discovery that is showing who we actually are within nature. And it's not enough to just know the brain areas and the tissue and the organs and, and the conflict theme. To me it's not enough. It's more about being a living, breathing embodiment of the revolution. Because that is the revolution. I am fully sovereign. I am Teflon when I'm there with my bare foot on the floor and in nature and under the stars and Amongst the trees and amongst my tribe and listening, really listening, then I truly. Sovereign. Speaker A 00:56:03.620 - 00:58:27.260 Well said. Yeah, it really seems like, you know, people talk about freedom so much, but it's almost as if, and we've heard these other people say this before, that people ultimately want freedom from freedom, like to really take this level of personal responsibility for your life and what happens to you even when you're looking, looking at things from a health standpoint because again, it's, it's, it's kind of convenient to want to blame a toxin or blame a microbe when you know there's more to the story. And again, I'm not sitting here saying that toxins don't play a role. You know, our world has be, is becoming more and more increasingly toxic. And obviously in G and M, we've talked about this in previous episodes that there are cases for disease manifestation outside of the DHS GNM framework. You know, malnutrition, poisoning, physical trauma. And so then the question goes, well, malnutrition, to what degree, poisoning, to what degree does a cumulative toxic, toxic load play a role? You know, but again, I still find it interesting because I know so many people in the world where there are those who are so healthy, they do all the right things, you know, they live a toxic free life and yet they're coming down with healing responses. They're coming down with quote unquote sickness and disease. And then there are those who like have peace and harmony in their lives and eat what they want and go outside when there's quote unquote chemtrails and live next to cell phone towers and they're also fine. Like, I'm sure there's some logical fallacies in there that I just said, but like, it's interesting to note and to observe. But yes, I'd love to like your thoughts. Like when Hammer, obviously when this knowledge was coming forth, you know, the 1980s was very different than now in terms of what's happening in the world in more vaccination, you know, more opportunities to disrupt natural biological programming with chemicals that we've never, we can't even freaking pronounce. So like we're currently where you are on your journey. How do you relate to this? Like, how do you relate to those? Like these three things can cause disease outside of the G and M framework. And like, you know, what are your thoughts on it? Because that's another thing I think that people, like, even people that are into G and M, they're just like, well listen, I just think there's lots of toxins. And that's probably playing a big role and a cause of, of symptom manifestation. Speaker B 00:58:29.180 - 01:02:00.420 Well, and it's for us to also examine. We have to rule it out. So we have to look at the, the, the individual. And this is where, when you're blaming a toxin or when you're operating on the theory that the toxin is what's causing my quote, unquote, dis ease, that is also a grand generalization that is not dealing with biology in accordance with an individual person and what they're actually experiencing. That's also kind of a blanket overview that we're using. And if we're, if it's not a one size fits all, and our biology isn't, but this sort of toxic theory would necessarily be a one size fits all theory. And it's really interesting because, yes, of course, we would have to take that into account. I mean, look at all the pregnant women that took thalidomide and they, they birthed babies that had, you know, malfunctions and had organs and limbs missing. Well, of course, that was directly because of a toxin and a poison that they were ingesting into their body while pregnant. So in that case, we would not say that that was a conflict. But, you know, there's been interesting studies done. For example, there are the killifish that reside on the eastern coast, and they're in these estuaries that are polluted by factories. So they have very, very high toxic exposure. And what they did was they conducted some studies and research on these fish that when they removed them and they looked at them in the lab environment, when they compared them with the same species of fish that wasn't exposed to the toxins, the ones that weren't exposed, they died faster and they had more disease when exposed versus the ones who had already grown up and lived in these estuaries that were covered with pollutants. Yeah. That were well past the normal or safe range. When they were exposed to more toxins in the lab, they were less sensitive. And I think it passed on to something like eight different generations as well. So even the generations that followed the original fish that were living in this highly polluted environment, the following generations were also less sensitive when being exposed to toxins. And there's been different studies done on, you know, certain species of frogs. I think, I believe that this was in Chernobyl, and they started to have more pigmented outer skin. Yeah. Than the frogs that were coming out of these radioactive sites. Which makes sense. Right. The, the darker pigmentation that could be an Attack, conflict, or better protecting, growing a thicker skin to better be able to withstand my environment. So we do have studies showing that our biology is not detoxing. Okay, Right. So this is different. So it's not that I'm being exposed to a toxin and then I'm detoxing from it, but rather I'm actually creating generational adaptation so that my next offspring can better handle, adapt and survive to this exposure of the toxin and be less sensitive toward it. So there is evidence showing that. So could we also bring that into play? Like, is there a theory that perhaps while, yes, we are being more exposed to toxins than ever before, that we would also biologically adapt toward that too? Speaker A 01:02:01.220 - 01:02:30.280 Yeah. What do you. Thank you for sharing. Sharing all that. Another phrase that gets thrown a lot, thrown out a lot when we're thinking about, you know, disease causation is bioresonance. Like, what are, what's your view on that? Even within the gnm, you know, framework, or just your personal experience that, like, you know, being around someone that is, you know, exhibiting symptoms, then signals to your body, okay, I think I should go through this process as well. Speaker B 01:02:32.270 - 01:03:57.120 Well, and this is where, you know, we can experience something collectively at this psyche level, but it's not really a bioresonance because I think even, even if we are all getting quote, unquote, sick at the same time, and we're near each other and we're interacting with each other, if we really looked at the individual, our symptoms would not be exactly the same. And therefore our symptoms, not being exactly the same, would already show through our framework, that we interpreted the event or the conflict a little bit differently. So, yeah. Who are the people that are closest to us? Right. Our family. So it's like, think about what's going on within the family home, within the family system. Oftentimes, you know, someone says, oh, my, my son just got better. He just got over his sickness and now I got it, so he must have given it to me. Right. And so think about it. Maybe they got a cough, which was a scare, fright, conflict, because they were worried for that their son, was he going to be okay? Right. Or maybe we believe in germs. So we, we separated somebody and put them in their room and quarantined them. And then when we came back together, we resolved a separation conflict. So we have to take these things into account that absolutely we as a collective can experience something. And could you call that bio resonance? Yeah, perhaps, maybe. Right, Maybe. Speaker A 01:03:58.330 - 01:03:58.730 Yeah. Speaker C 01:03:59.690 - 01:04:08.890 Erasmus, do you want to share some of your, like, Personal experiences where like GNM has really come into play as the primary explanatory mechanism for what you went through. Speaker A 01:04:09.450 - 01:12:30.030 Well, yeah, thanks for asking. You know, I think the ones that really hit for me, I'm going to start with this one that happened I think three years ago now. There's a easement road that runs through our property that acts as the driveway to our neighbor's home. And so a few years ago we had major rains in Los Angeles. And after the first rain, I think it was around New Year's, New Year's Day, 20, 23, I went down there and the culvert that goes from like a, kind of a, kind of a creek on our property underneath the easement road to empty into the greater creek, it was backed up. And so this whole back area of our property got flooded. And I was like, fuck, okay, let's see what happens kind of once the rain settled, I cleared out a bit. Then a huge rain came. A month and a half later, it was February 20, 23 and 6, 7ft of flooding happened. Sophie was out of town the next morning. I got up and I went down there and 80% of the easement road, like 20ft wide, 15ft deep, sunk, just sunk. And I just remember that moment, like mouth drop. Wtf? What the do I do? Like, is this my responsibility? Is it my neighbor's responsibility? There are people that live behind us where the driveway goes, renting the place. So I'm like, I don't even know the owners of the property. And so I began this process of like, I need to, you know, I call Sophie, she was in Switzerland. We're having a conversation. I go online, I'm researching all this stuff. I find out the information also to the owners, I'm in contact with them. I realized that we, even though we own the property, that we're not responsible for the maintenance of the easement. And so the owners of the property, they were living in England at the time. They finally send me a text. We realize it's our responsibility. We've reached out to someone who is going to come and fix it. And that was ended up being like a few month process. But once I read that message, within an hour I was at the toilet shitting water for three days straight. Okay, so can I prove that this event is what caused the conflict? Like, well, no, but my experience matters and I, I don't think it was a detox and I don't think I had food poisoning that day that led to me shitting water for three days. Something that's never really happened to me before. And so understanding GNM to the degree that I did a few years ago and looking into things that made complete sense. And so from that standpoint, I was like, well, this sucks and it doesn't feel good, but my body is doing exactly what it's supposed to be doing. And so I just let it do that. I spent a lot of time on the toilet shitting water, and then I was fine. I didn't take any medication. I don't think I took any supplements. I just chilled out and let my body do what it does. Which is interesting because knowing this, I applied this even to our dog, Rosie, because we would go away on vacation maybe for a few days when we. If we couldn't bring her with us or a week, and we'd come back. And usually right after coming back, she would have some type of symptom manifestation, whether it was diarrhea, whether it was like throwing up bile or whatever the case may be. There were things happening. And in the early years, we might be like, oh, my God, do we need to bring her somewhere? Do we need to give her some stuff? And I would just be like, let's just chill. Her body knows what to do. Let's just love her and be there with her. And after two, three days, back to normal, normal, normal biological process. A normal stool. And we've just keep. We've kept applying that. So that was something for me initially where it really, really landed. And I went like, there's something to this. Okay, am I 100% sure it was that? Well, no, but knowing myself, knowing the situation and having a certain amount of knowledge, I went, this makes the most sense. This feels the most accurate, especially when I started seeing it more around me and the people I was talking with and people in our Friends of the Truth community when they were sharing about their experiences, you know, so that was one major thing. The other thing that happened was this was maybe a couple years ago, I was in, like, Gomo doing a lot of things. I probably wasn't taking care of myself in the best way possible. You know, I was just focusing on things in my life. Going, going, going, going. I had been wanting to have a somatic experiencing session with someone online, Seth Lyon, we've had him on the podcast, and I finally was able to have a session with him online. And I remember sitting in the chair with him and there's having this realization like, wow, I have not received support or help in this way. And just, I just noticed my body Just kind of drop. And I just started weeping. I started weeping. And then we got into some real personal stuff on the call as well that there's no reason to talk about right now. But, like, I just remember freaking weeping. And then I wake up the next morning and I can't even open my mouth. I couldn't open my mouth. I had the worst pain in like my either tooth or jaw or whatever the case may be, just couldn't open it. It was, it was the worst. And Sophie was about to lead a three day retreat here and so I had to. My plan was to leave. And so I never go to like the dentist. You know, there's holistic biological dentists, but like, I just don't go to them because I'm just like, whatever, I'm fine. But for some reason, this was so bad, it was probably the worst pain I've had. And I couldn't open my mouth, so I couldn't eat, I couldn't drink if I swallowed my own saliva. It was like the most excruciating pain. It felt like there was like swelling in my lymph node. And so I did go see this biological dentist and he was like, well, you know, you probably got some bacteria under your thing there. And actually, I don't ever recommend this to people at your age, but I think you need to take your wisdom teeth out. And here's someone who is like highly respected biological holistic dentist who doesn't just take people's wisdom teeth out. And again, having the understanding that I have, to the degree that I have it of, of GNM and the five biological laws, I went, there's a reason for this. I don't need to take my wisdom teeth out, you know. And he, and he, he said to me, he's like, listen, just go take like six tablets of oregano oil every two hours for the next few days. And also some arnica pain medications. I didn't take the oregano oil, but I took the arnica. And so the arnica was definitely subsiding the pain. I was like, oh, thank God. Because it was, I couldn't, I really. It was tough to function. And so I went out of town because Sophie was holding her retreat. I went out of town for a couple days and that first night I just made the decision because the, the arnica kind of wore off, wore off and the pain came back. And I just made this decision. My body is doing what it's doing. I don't need to take anything. I'm fine. And so the Next day I was able to open my mouth a little bit more, the next day a little bit more. And I was able to like throw some like cold, like turkey cold cuts in my mouth and actually swallow it without excruciating pain. And like four days later I was back to normal, you know. And so again, what would be the explanation from someone in the allopathic world? What would be the explanation of someone that's, you know, more alternative or in the terrain world around what happened in that situation? You know what I mean? And so for me, I don't, I don't know if I know the exact maybe conflict that was resolved a little bit because it was a little tricky to know. I didn't know it was my tooth, it was the, it was the, the jaw, whatever the case may be. But it felt like that was more accurate through the five biological G and M model. Anyways, there's other stories I can get into after, but those were two initially that really landed for me. Speaker B 01:12:30.750 - 01:14:49.420 Yeah, you know, you got the jaw, which is a bite conflict, not being able to bite back. And maybe you had worked through that in the somatic experiencing, but you know, the T. Tmj, that trigeminal nerve is the conflict of needing to save face, not wanting to show my true emotions. I cannot show my emotions. So that would make that you go through this somatic experience and you start weeping, right? You feel safe in front of this person and you start weeping. And maybe now that the trigeminal nerve is now going into healing and going into resolution, and especially if you, you would kind of know because it would have maybe also felt like full head pressure. I don't know if that felt full head pressure for you at that time, but you might have had even a little bit of the flavor of the trigeminal nerve there. And yeah, with the limbs you might have had like a little bit of a self devaluation, but you know, you needed to go through the entire experience to get out the other side. And this is a really hard thing for people to come to terms with when it comes to grandisha, because there's no magic wand that's going to put your symptom away. And actually in our primal nature, even if you've resolved the conflict, the intensity of the conflict that you went through is going to be the intensity of the healing phase or the symptom that you're experiencing. And so I always like to use the example of when a woman is giving birth and she's in labor. This is a biological Sacred experience. She can't say. I mean, Joel, you witnessed this with your wife. She can't say, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, I'm. Stop. Body, body, stop. I don't want this anymore. Make the symptoms go away. Baby's not coming. No, she can't hold it back. The baby is coming whether she's liking it or not. Nature is saying, baby comes today. Baby is saying, I'm coming into mommy's arms today. And there is nothing you can do to halt, stop, or slow down. The experience. You have to go through the complete biological journey of it until you get out the other side and that beautiful baby is in your arms. Right? This is the same way, the same force that created life, that creates the baby. You know, when. When a man and a woman are intimate together, they are also going through this biological adaptation, this biological force of the orgasm. Speaker A 01:14:49.420 - 01:14:49.550 And. Speaker B 01:14:49.700 - 01:15:21.890 And that is following beautifully the 2Face program. We are going golfing. God, until we get to that epic crisis, till we get to that point of complete ecstasy. And the same method that creates the baby is the same method that brings the baby out into the world again. And we can't turn it off. And that's why we're primal. We can't say, no, I don't want this anymore. Oh, oh, no, I can't do this anymore. I'm not strong enough to do this. This is what's really coming down to getting back to who we truly are. Speaker A 01:15:22.770 - 01:19:16.970 Yeah, it's so interesting too, because I. I even, like, think back to, like, my time in New York City, you know, when I lived there in like, my 20s to early 30s. Like, I was bar, I was bartending. New York. I was working till 5 in the morning. My circadian rhythms were off. I was drinking, I was partying, I was experimenting with other things. You know what I mean? Like, I wasn't probably eating that healthy. And I don't really have any recollection of going through seasonal detoxes, like, at all. My life was harmonious. There was so much pleasure and, like, alignment, and I was doing the things that I loved. I had great relationships, and I just don't remember. And actually, I think the only time I remember coming down was something that just knocked me on my ass. I'm pretty sure it was right after I got robbed, assaulted, and mugged in my friend's apartment building. You know what I mean? So again, it's like, oh, but you. You weren't get. You weren't waking up for the sunrise every day. You're awesome. You weren't eating perfectly, you were poisoning yourself with alcohol. You should have had your seasonal detox, which I never did have. And not saying that stuff was good for me doesn't. Not saying that stuff didn't impact my day to day. And like, you know, maybe my mental health to some degree in terms of, like, maybe I felt lethargic by working till 5, 6 in the morning, you know what I mean? But in terms of like some major symptom, manifestation, it just didn't happen. And also, I shared this with you just recently in our, I guess, dining room. When we first moved in five years ago, I had a canvas made, like, I don't know, 4ft by 3ft canvas made and put on the wall. And one day I was like, I kept saying, okay, I'm going to create an abstract piece of art for this room. And one year goes by, two years go by, three years go by, four years go by, five years go by for anyone that has been to our home. At one of our gatherings, they, in the dining room, they just see a blank canvas. And I used to joke and be like, this is my work of art called Invisible. I hope you like it. But I never did it. But I always was like, I gotta do this, I gotta do this. Like, it was definitely like a story, like, when the fuck am I going to do this? And then since we were hosting a lot of people for Christmas, Sophie was like, maybe this is the time that, like, you can use this as motivation to get it done. So we have a back little studio. I'm like, let me do this. Let me put out some, you know, tarp. Let me throw that canvas down there, let me buy my paint and let me get to work doing my thing. And so, you know, after a couple of days, obviously different layers, letting things dry. I finished, was done that night. I'm like, why are my hamstrings and my glutes so sore? Like, I understand. I was kind of leaning over. It could have been just the way I was doing the art, but this feels weird. Then it was like this whole body ache and pain and I'm like, this doesn't seem like just me being sore. Then I just plop down on the couch. Felt weak that night, shivering, you know, sweating at night. I pretty sure I had a temperature. I just felt shitty for like two, three days. And I'm like, oh, this goes away. I gotta cook a feast for like 11 people for Christmas. So either the morning of Christmas Eve or the day before, I woke up feeling better. But again, Anyone listening? Why do you think that happened to me? Was it because I ate something? I mean, it was just odd. It was very odd that I would have all these total body aches. I didn't do anything differently. I didn't eat anything differently. I didn't all of a sudden poison myself. Yet there was something very specific that happened, which was I finished this piece of artwork that I hadn't done for five years. And I definitely had some mental noise around it. So anyways, I wanted to share that. Speaker B 01:19:17.930 - 01:19:21.370 I love that. It's a great story. And I saw the painting, by the way. It looks great. Speaker A 01:19:21.800 - 01:21:09.880 Cool, Cool. I can't wait to see it in person. So, anyways, I. I guess I'm saying all this as an invitation to everyone who's listening. Now, if you're a regular listener of the podcast, I would assume you've heard one of our previous nine conversations on, you know, G&M, G, H, K5 biological law, related subjects. And so I would assume that it lands. It resonates for you and for some of you, maybe there are other things in our podcast that you like more and you're not fully on board with this knowledge, but I'm inviting you to really take a deep look at the events in your life and how you perceive the events in your life, and to see if you can map and track the symptoms that have manifested at different points in your life. Okay. And just enjoy this exercise, you know, like, see what happens moving forward. If you're listening to this episode, see if you can connect the dots. And again, I'm not going to sit here and say Dr. Harmer's work explains every health conundrum known to humanity, and it is the Bible and anything else is wrong. I'm not. I'm saying it's my belief. Yes. It's my belief. So that's okay. I can say belief that this body of work and this knowledge has supported in understanding my role in life, my role as. As how it connects to nature and how things are showing up in my life and in my body. And it has allowed me to have more freedom, it has allowed me to have more peace, and has allowed me to understand the freaking miracle of nature in this, in such a personal way. And so I invite everyone to go on that journey. Speaker C 01:21:11.240 - 01:21:14.280 Beautifully said, man. Any closing statements from you, Natasha? Speaker B 01:21:16.040 - 01:26:30.390 Well, I would just like to say that this wisdom for me is very sacred and it's very precious. And, you know, in Germany, we say it's Heinrich, it's holy. And Dr. Hamer really did Treat it that way. And just like Erasmus was beautifully sharing his stories, it's meant to build a beautiful relationship between you and your biology. And it's really easy to get caught up in the data and the numbers. And yes, we are showing the foci. And yes, we are showing the case studies, and yes, we are trying to also accumulate research. But I also want to implore you, listening, that your biology is not beyond you. There's no authoritative figure or expert, not Even I or Dr. Hamer, who you need to listen to. You need to listen to the wisdom that is already lying within you. And to me, this sacred biological information that I had the immense honor of being raised upon is what allowed me to see that mirror all throughout my life and to live in that connection fully and wholeheartedly, always. And one of the sayings that's so beautiful that I learned is that the land does not belong to us, but we belong to the land. And many ancient tribes taught me that phrase. And so what I like to say is that the body does not belong to us, but we belong to the body, right? Because we will have to give this back when we are finished. And even on my own evolution, as I dive deeper into how I integrate this wisdom into my life, like, wow. I mean, just being back here in the jungle and being back with some of the amazing, incredible souls that I've also had the privilege to learn and study from has been such a deepening experience. And so it's even unraveling more layers into how I can bring forth this knowledge in a very. How should I say? I would say in a very primal way. It's primordial. It's not even primal. It's primordial. And so as I've deeply evolved within that, I've had even more respect for what Hammer was really trying to convey. And that fifth Biological law, even if it seems airy fairy to some, it's actually the ultimate truth. And we are living in a society that is in a complete disillusion that we are separate from nature and we are not. And so if I can just be a steward of the Earth, then that is my ultimate role. You know, Melissa so beautifully changed her Instagram handle to the spokeswoman of nature. You know, and Alec so funnily said, I'm. I'm Melissa's battle buddy. But no, really, what I am is being a steward of the Earth. And being a steward of the nature of nature is really what it is to. To practice and bring forth this work. If you're like I'll tell like one final funny story. I don't know whether I told this story ever, but it's a funny one. Do you know Erasmus, the little Malibu shaman in. In the little village of Malibu? Have you ever been there? This very, I don't think, metaphysical, no. Okay, so this was a few years back when I was in my early 20s and living like you, kind of very mainstream. And I had grown up this way with. With my mother, but I had gone down my own route. I went into the Malibu shaman and I asked her, I asked the psychic woman, what's my purpose? And I think I wanted to be a designer or I wanted to be something. And she put her hands on the table and she said, there is this doctor here and he needs to speak to you. And I was like, there's no doctor in my family. Like, we hate doctors. And she goes, I am certain of it. And she literally described Dr. Hamer. She said, he's linked to your mother. He must be in your family. He's in your lineage somehow. He needs to come through. And he is related to what you're meant to do in the world. And I thought that is ludicrous. And it wasn't until years later that I remembered having this reading when I asked this woman, what am I meant to do this me, like, I must have been like 22 or something like that. What's my purpose in the world? And she says, you have this doctor here and you're meant to do this, and he has messages for you and he's like your guide. And I thought, that's wild. But now I understand more. And even I am evolving in the way in which I share this work. And I hope that this work evolves too. And I hope that as it becomes popular, it encourages discussions like this and conversations and other people who have even more wisdom and even more data and can prove this and show this even, even more. Is. Is so, so, so welcomed. Speaker C 01:26:31.190 - 01:26:32.030 That's wild. Speaker A 01:26:32.030 - 01:28:57.710 Thank you for that. Thank you for that. And yeah, I agree, like, having these types of conversations, we don't need to be so black and white. We need to search for the nuance and understanding. But again, ultimately, you know, it's in your hands. It's your life. You know, what do you do with this knowledge? And does this knowledge support you? Then, you know, keep going with it. I do want to say that Natasha is part of our community, Friends of the Truth. And every other month she leads our self healing circle where she is there to share knowledge and wisdom based on the Five biological laws. And we also have, in our telegram group, we have about 35 different channels. And one of the channels is G M&GHK. And so there's a lot of things going on in there. There are G M enthusiasts, people that are more familiar with the work. There are other practitioners besides Natasha that are in there as well. There are people new coming into our community that are being exposed to this knowledge for the first time and their minds are absolutely blown. And so it's beautiful to see that. So again, for anyone listening to this that wants to hang out with Joel, myself, Natasha and I don't know about 150 other people, although not everyone's active in telegram. Yeah, check out Friends of the Truth. You know, we are going to cap it at 200 people because we want to keep it intimate. And so, you know, we're at like what, our third price tier right now? I think it's $27 a month or $22 a month if you get it for the whole year. But that price, you know, will go up as we get closer to 200. So I would say jump on it, especially in 2026 if you're craving more community. People who understand you, people who get you, people who challenge you, inspire you. I really think Friends of the Truth is one of the greatest places on the interwebs for that. And if you love this podcast, if you're moved by what we do, would love to see you in there. One, for selfish reasons, I want to get to know you. I want to get to know more of our listeners and connect with you because every time I do, I love it. So just thank, just so thankful to our audience that are open to this kinds, these kinds of communications that are open to challenging their belief systems that are opening to realize, huh, this makes sense. What was I believing before this? Well, let me take this knowledge in and start applying into my life because these are the people that I love being around. Critical thinkers, open minded, deep human beings. And so I am just grateful to each and every one of you that listening right now. Speaker C 01:28:58.110 - 01:29:06.430 Yeah, for sure. Well said, man. And Natasha, if people wanted to reach out to you directly, follow you, find you, work with you, how can they go about doing that? Speaker B 01:29:07.710 - 01:30:04.650 Yeah, absolutely. You can follow me on Instagram, it's just at Natasha Nasrali, you can go to my personal website, natasha nasrali.com and you'll find all kinds of very magical biological things on there. And we also have the most amazing program. Well, I believe because we made it that way called the Biological woman that I run with Dr. Melissa Sal. And we start that next February 3, 2026. That's the next round. We do it twice a year and it's the most intimate container of women where we go through the complete female organ anatomy from head to toe. And yeah, it's our, it's pretty much our best selling course. And it's just such, such an incredible group of women that it attracts every time. So if you're new to this work and you're a woman and you're looking to understand yourself more deeply with some like minded women, I encourage you to join that too. Speaker C 01:30:05.210 - 01:30:40.340 Amazing guys. You killed it. Thank you so much for having this conversation. I think it's really good to explore, you know, all branches of this and especially as the conversation evolves because as you mentioned, it is beginning to come into the mainstream fray more so and it will continue to over time and there's going to be more questions and you know, obviously that promotes more discussion and that's what we're here for. So everyone, thank you again for listening. And on the Friends of the Truth front, if you're down, it's herefor the truth.com forward/fot. We'll see you next time. Take care.