Chance Garton Magic, Crystals & the Dark Side of Crypto

[Speaker 3] (0:00 - 0:08) You are now listening to the Here for the Truth podcast, hosted by Joel Rafiti and Erasmus Skelionesis. [Speaker 2] (0:13 - 1:21) Welcome back everybody to Here for the Truth. Got another awesome guest here, Chance Garten. This is episode 15. Chance and I connected last year when he invited me and Sophie onto his podcast, which is really really cool. So, Chance is someone we wanted to have on, so happy that he's made the time to be here. I just want to share a little bit about Chance. He's a creator of all trades and enthusiastic mirror of self-awareness. Seeking refinement for a collective consciousness, Chance dedicates his energy to inspiring positive evolution in his life through connecting with others who are on their own path to perfection. In being the change we want to see in the world, we manifest greater potential for all. Dude, I love it, man. I love the work you're doing. I love the name of your podcast, Innerverse. It just makes me think so much of the fact that so many people are externally focused and then we have this whole inner world, inner reality that people just seem to ignore and even more so in the world we're living today. Thanks for coming on, man. [Speaker 1] (1:22 - 1:37) Hey, yeah, it's good to meet you, Joel, and to reconnect with you, Erasmus. We had a really awesome conversation off-air. We were bragging about, or I was bragging about how that was the last episode I got a strike for, for saying a naughty word. [Speaker 2] (1:38 - 2:02) For me, too. It was the first time that I feel like I was being like, oh my god, I've made it. I wanted to call my mom and be like, I made it. Not that she would understand. She's an old Greek lady. She'd be like, yeah, Erasmus, what do you mean no on YouTube? You know, she wouldn't understand what's going on. But I feel like that was like my initial moment and of course Instagram shadowbanning me hard. So, you know, we're doing something good in the world if we're being shadowbanned and censored. That's my view of it. [Speaker 1] (2:03 - 2:22) Yeah, but no fear guys. You can find that episode on YouTube if you still use that funk platform. I confess I still watch things on it, too. But the episode's not pulled. It was just the link to Erasmus's website. That was it. So make that what you will. Probably should hit him up for some services. Cool, cool. [Speaker 3] (2:22 - 2:25) Erasmus is a controversial word, bro. [Speaker 2] (2:25 - 2:37) I think so, man. Erasmus, they're like, what is that? What code word is that? So Chance, man, I'm going to ask you this first question. What inspired you to start Interverse? [Speaker 1] (2:38 - 6:01) That's awesome. Yeah, I got really interested in doing podcasts and gradually over time, I was introduced to them at a point in my life where I was trying to make some grown up moves in my early 20s. And even though I don't even listen to the shows that I listened to back then, just listening to different positive voices in my head instead of the same thought patterns over and over again or whatever, that alone helped me even build a mindfulness practice that I was working on simultaneously because it's like listening instead of monkey mind chatter, you could say. And there's an upside and downside to that. You can go to the point of not giving yourself any time to think. And you need that, too. But interesting conversations that I was having with close friends as I was going through the beginning of my waking up process made me really wish that I could share those conversations with other people, especially because of how much it had helped me to have positive voices to listen to. And so I started my show. I really didn't know why I named it Interverse until further down the line because I just wanted to talk to artists and creative people mostly at that time. I wasn't really sure of a specific direction. I'm still really into talking to creators of any kind because I think creativity and your personal vision of art is like the spiritual path for the unique, individuated person. It's the path where the further you want to go on it, the more self-work you have to do, because you'll always hit a level of a plateau at any form of creativity or even as like an athlete, unless you start to do work outside of the process that you're trying to improve to improve yourself generally. So I wanted to be able to create a platform, a space where people could connect to others that don't necessarily get a voice that often. I've kind of shifted that. And I'll talk to people that have a large audience online now because I'm interested in such a wider variety of topics since the being led down the garden path to Alice's rabbit hole was an inevitable aspect of being interested in crunchy, esoteric topics while doing a podcast and having to listen to people for a couple of hours. It was like I wanted to make the show that was most interesting to me to hear. And anyway, the funny thing about the name, a quick anecdote is you guys ever heard of like Seven Bomar Secret Energy before? I haven't known. It's a pretty cool website, and he's a very awesome, inspirational speaker. And anyway, he was introduced to me on the seventh episode of my show by my guest. And he has an entire like online coursework thing called the Innerversity. And it was the seventh episode, and his name is Seven. So that's somebody people should check out. Secret Energy is a pretty cool website with tons of useful esoteric information and metaphysical fam community finder type options. So anyway, that's kind of a long winded answer. But yeah, since I started it, it's just been an awesome ride of growth and change and getting to connect with people all over the world and doing what I love, which is to have heady chats with people about whatever we want to get into a flow in that day. [Speaker 3] (6:02 - 6:43) Yeah, man, absolutely. I couldn't agree more, man. Like, I mean, if we're not pursuing a creative ideal, or if that's not involved in what we're doing on some level, then really, who are we? You know what I mean? And what are we doing? Because I know for me, creativity and imagination, it's the realest part of myself, right? That's the part that's constantly pulling me forward. And urging me to grow in some kind of direction and to continue to unlock what that potential is and where it's guiding me down and what it's asking me to express next. And man, I think it's a dope that that's a deeper call for you. And that's the reason that you create. I mean, that's everything to me. So love that. [Speaker 1] (6:43 - 7:12) And you're Asmos, our mutual friend to Sarian, turned me on to the phrasing of the imagination in a different perspective, which is that imagining isn't a type of thinking. All thinking comes from imagining. So it's like the baseline aspect. It's not just a connection to source. I think it is source, personally. But that's a deeper cosmological viewpoint to hold, I guess. [Speaker 3] (7:12 - 7:28) Well, Jung said that we do not have creative powers. We are possessed by creative powers, right? So it's really the creativity that is primary. And we adjust the modality at the end of the day. So, yeah, man, sure. [Speaker 2] (7:30 - 8:01) I don't know if there's a little bit of a delay at all. If it's coming from me or if it's chances, but it's all good. Dude, what was the catalyst for your... I don't want to say awakening because it's always a process. But what was it where you were like, oh, yeah, I'm just kind of living my life, doing my thing. And then you're like, there's some shit going on. And I need to figure it out and investigate and peel behind the layers and look behind the veil. And what was it? And when did it happen? [Speaker 1] (8:02 - 14:16) So in my early 20s, I just graduated from college. I was feeling kind of low self-esteem, even though in a lot of ways, I was in the best place I've ever been in my life. I was in good shape. I did get a degree, which wasn't that relevant other than as an English creative writing degree, it helped me with symbolic literacy that I actually carried forward into studying the occult. And it was very useful. But anyway, I got out of college and I still hadn't decided what I wanted for me yet. And I ended up working for my parents' company, which was not a bad move, actually, because it had a good place for me to work while I tried to kind of find myself, I guess. And up to that point, I'd just been mostly doing the track that I was put on, finish high school, go to college, finish college, just doing what society or family was expected of you, trying to be that guy that was externally programmed, if you will. And that wasn't working for me so well. And in that time period, I had a couple of my first psychedelic experiences, which were kind of meant to be recreational. But for me, it was like, okay, there's a spirit world. There's stuff you can communicate with. They can give you accurate information and even tell you what the future is and all kinds of stuff that is completely subjective to me. And it's just stories if I were to tell it to anybody. But at that point, I had a serious knowledge that something was going on. And in the pursuit of just trying new things and making friends and what I'd always wanted to do, which was see more music, I started going to a lot of festivals in my early 20s. And that's where I got turned on to art as realizing that there were so many people out there that don't get nearly enough exposure, which was part of what inspired me to start a show to talk to people like that initially. And what they're doing is pursuing their soul's passion or their highest calling, whatever you want to call it, or a livelihood. And they're setting up their life up in a way where they always get to be or frequently get to be enmeshed with a community of people with similar values. And I've done plenty of interviews in the past about the dark side of festival scene or just music culture and fake counterculture, controlled counterculture, even psychedelic energy vampires. All that stuff is very present at events like that. But there's also really rad people, like I said, who are just hustling on their creativity and doing it because they love it. And even those people have all kinds of range of whether or not they're savory characters. And that's interesting in and of itself. But that was it for me getting into that type of world. I started trying to pursue art as like a career and it didn't end up being something that I wanted to pursue full time. Like I've tried a vending booth, selling my posters and other things I make and paintings and stuff. And it's fun, but now I realize that I'd really rather be out there doing like secret shaman energy work in a crowd of people that are really high vibing because that's where it's really interesting. And that's what I was doing in my early 20s. I did psychedelics a lot back then. I don't now. They're unnecessary for me to reach any of those states that I'm talking about. But I would see and feel energy, especially from stuff like crystals, from practices that I picked up like Qigong. And I wasn't like abusing the psychedelic experience, but at a certain point, it did take me to a wall or a cliff. And it was like, you keep going with this, you're hopping off this cliff here. I was like, okay, we're gonna get grounded and rooted in something that's more permanent and has more stability. And I wanna create a container for my creative energy that as I add to it, it will retain that value and that value will build. And so that started off as like an Etsy shop selling stuff that I made. And everything that I made towards that goal was like filling that container. And I watched it grow. And I stayed consistent at it for a couple of years. And I was like, this is a real thing. If you just keep at something, you'll get better at it. And if you create a container or a space to hold the energy of what you're putting effort into, that will grow. It's like an investment. And so with all that knowledge and the realization that I could like easily teach myself to learn anything that I wanted to learn, because I'd been teaching myself different styles of computer graphics programs and how to like, I took some drawing classes. I was doing the autodidact thing. So I decided to apply that to podcasting because I knew that if I now had the experience and the knowledge to know that if I stuck at it, it would eventually, I would be living the life that I was imagining for myself, which is what I'm doing now. I mean, I still gotta do some other things as ways to make money, but I get to have conversations like this, be in the guest seat now. I have an amazing network around the country of people that I could probably hit up and abide if I was somewhere else. I don't know, man. It's like the coolest ride, the best journey, but it all came from those core realizations that you should have some kind of container to put your creative energy into and consistency, and you'll get somewhere. And really the only difference between us and the people we look up to and idolize the time and effort that went into them becoming that thing that we idolize. So I don't really like the idea of talent. I know that there's natural aptitudes, but I also know that we are very versatile. Our brains are super plastic. Other than like some fantasy-based reality versions of you can be anything you want, like I couldn't be a different gender and race other than on paper. There's the imagination is a portal that can take you anywhere that you want to go, any self you want to be. And it's all about just building up the energy into that portal and keeping it active. [Speaker 2] (14:16 - 14:41) You know, real quick, speaking of talent, I had an old acting teacher. He has a quote that says, talent is as common as horseshit in a stable. The cultivation of it is extremely rare. And so that kind of goes hand in hand in like the consistency and putting in the work and being on the hero's journey and living a heroic life and doing the work, you know, because again, I think a lot of people were born with a certain level of aptitude, but then what do you do with it? [Speaker 3] (14:42 - 14:50) Well, it's the discipline that's missing most of the time, right? Especially with creatives I find, and particularly creatives that are trying to make a living through their creations. [Speaker 1] (14:53 - 17:06) Yeah, and that was always a big focus of my early explorations because I wanted to figure out how for myself to cross that threshold. Of my livelihood being my creativity and maybe it's just my nature, but I've kind of taken like a slow, gradual approach to that instead of making any big cataclysmic changes because part of what has allowed me to do this job well, in my opinion, or as well as I have, maybe not as well as I could, but it's been grounding in a stable life outside of the practice and being able to afford healthy enough food, which isn't as hard as people would think. But I made that as a resolution several years back that I should get used to what it costs to buy organics now so that that's the threshold of what I expect food to cost instead of trying to claw my way into being able to pay for that while paying for, I don't know, medical bills or whatever. I guess I probably wouldn't go to a hospital, but you still rack up bills with holistic practitioners and all that. So yeah, grounding in a stable lifestyle helped with it, but on the discipline side, the other thing that helps with discipline is care. Like really it's the principle of care that fuels the cultivation of the talent and care without it, nothing would happen at all in the whole cosmos. It's like the driving emotion. It's the motor for things and so the best way to make sure that you care about what you're doing, I guess, is ask yourself the question or be flexible with your approach to things and not let yourself get in a rut just for the sake of trying to maintain consistency where you're doing something that is no longer interesting or exciting to you. I don't think I need to tell people to not be motivated by the prospect of potentially making money off of their creativity, but it's not something to be close-minded to either. It shouldn't be your primary motivation, but you should be open to it. I think that's kind of a way to think about it. Anyway, where are we going next? [Speaker 3] (17:07 - 17:39) Definitely, man. I mean, my primary modality is a hip hop artist. That's something I've done for over a decade now and my biggest struggle has been trying to convert that into something that's consistently providing me with a monetary income so I can keep doing that and I can keep filling the cup that way. So I hear that, absolutely. Have you found that your Qigong practice has helped you in cultivating discipline to be able to help your process? [Speaker 1] (17:42 - 18:08) Man, I had like super brain fog drained by too much use of the tech today. And I knew though, when I got done with the other work I had to do today, that if I just went outside barefoot, even in the sun, even though it's kind of hot, just did my breath work and Qigong, that I would be all set for a conversation tonight and ready to just hop into the flow state. [Speaker 2] (18:08 - 18:11) And it's absolutely true. Put on your blue blockers too. [Speaker 1] (18:11 - 19:14) I mean, without that, I don't know if you'd be able to do it. Yeah, I remembered everything. I got the hat with my sign on it, you know, like a name tag. But for sure, the only thing about Qigong is that my discipline at it hasn't been great, honestly. But even without, like there's been times in my life where I had a super consistent practice for long periods of time. And so it's not to say that I've like mastered anything, but I'm better at it than when I first started. So I can, even without a super consistent practice, get a lot of benefit out of just dropping into one session. And a lot of that has been from the slow and steady cultivation of inner energetic awareness. And that's, you know, there's always further to go on that path. So getting back on a more disciplined regimented frequency for me would just help me get there. But ultimately, it's good to not beat yourself up for what you didn't do, but just make the most out of what you do. [Speaker 2] (19:15 - 20:48) Yeah, for sure. Another question I want to ask, man, is because, you know, I think we're all, we can all relate on being on this truth-seeking journey and, you know, being heretics in our own way and living the life of following our heart and doing what we need to do. I'm curious for you, how was it, you know, when you started going on this alternative path and you start questioning the status quo and you start doing things differently and you start going down these rabbit holes, you know, there is this shift that happens with the people in your life and very often family as well and close friends, like, how was that for you as you kind of were evolving more into the person that you're meant to be in this lifetime and kind of, and, you know, slowly dissolve the hold of the superego and the culture and society that you were kind of programmed to be, let's say in your first 15, 20 years, you know, like how was that journey for you from a relationship standpoint? Because you mentioned earlier in our pre-chat, like, yeah, you know, like when this whole thing happened last year, I was doing all these fucking talks on masks and shit like that, you know, like how, now that's, I'm sure you've gotten into a lot of other things, but this last 16, 17 months for a lot of people, I've been having this conversation with people has been this thing where relationships have disintegrated, divorces have happened, families have splintered because of differences in views and what's even happening. So I'm just curious in your whole journey, how has that been for you? [Speaker 1] (20:49 - 28:13) It's a great question. Really from the start, I've always had this kind of like outsider vibe slinking around the edges of any group that I might be interested in being with. So never been a big group joiner, and maybe that's why it was easy for me to not be swayed by the mass mind this time around, although I was pretty far down the rabbit hole, so it wasn't likely that this would trick me. I do remember last March, I think there was one day near the beginning of it all, where for like two minutes, I started thinking, oh shit, what if I actually get sick? What if I die from this thing? And then I felt like this fear of death. And I went, wait, I've already dealt with the fear of death. What is this? Where is this even coming from? And I realized right then, like this is what other people are feeling or were feeling then, maybe it's worn off by now or maybe it's just a low level rob, but people were actually feeling that exact feeling, but not identifying it, kind of neutralizing it, or didn't have some past experience of, like for me, meditation, the first year or two, hell, like three years of meditation, half the time I was sitting there, if I wasn't in like the clear mind with no thoughts, it was just like, oh shit, I'm gonna die. I'm gonna die one day, oh man. And it was just like nonstop. And so I sat with that for so long and I'm immune to it now. It's a superpower you can get from meditation. Not that like if there was something threatening my life right here in the moment, I wouldn't have a bodily reaction to that for sure. But that abstract fear that is constantly being pumped into people for all kinds of reasons, since at least the late 70s or early 80s, that's been something I was looking at in a video I was watching earlier today that was fascinating how in the 80s and 90s, there was a huge ramp up in the way that the news was constantly trying to tell people all the ways that they could be killed violently at any moment without any awareness of it coming from other people, from invisible things, yada, yada, yada. So that's been going on. But being kind of an outsidery person, like I always found myself doing the opposite of what everybody else was doing most of the time anyway. For good and bad. And so as I moved forward into being this podcast host guy, like when I first got into alternative thinking, it was really around the healing and energy practices. And so that didn't really rub people the wrong way that I knew, I don't think. And it was fun because I did have like a solid group of friends back then that I would go to, I literally would go to raves and bring crystals and like do Reiki on people. I was like a rave Reiki wizard. My 20s were fun. But anyway, eventually, like, yeah, like my searching, not really searching, just being on my path, synchronicity kept leading me to the next thing to check out. Like it was a massive synchronicity how I found out about Qigong. It was a massive synchronicity how I started figuring out what was going on with government. And so I was able to investigate these things over the course of years and people kind of were already poised to look at me as like the crazy guy, crazy conspiracy guy. Although, you know, in a one-on-one conversation, nobody could really like back up any dispute to when I would explain something about why money is debt and income taxes, theft and all these different things or with any, you know, name your flavor of conspiratorial topic that I would just regurgitate at friends all the time. So I could see why that would be a little difficult. And I wouldn't say that I was like doom and gloom or negative about it, but I would be very like authoritative. Like I know what's going on. So there was a point where I started getting sort of invited to hang out with friends or groups of friends less and less. And on my end, I was so busy in my hustles that I wasn't reaching out to people anyway. And I was getting kind of a new flavor of social interaction by getting to meet people online anyway for conversations that, you know, there's something really cool about reading a book, really loving the book and then getting to talk to the author. And then you and that person are kind of like friends online and you could talk to them again or send them an email or whatever. It's super cool. And so as the pandemic stuff ramped up, my approach to online confrontation was super simple. As soon as a person got disrespectful or crazy in a comment, I just blocked them no matter who they were. Instant block, no engagement really. Okay, so I didn't do that instantly. I learned to do that really quickly because things would just devolve. And then some people you might see them offline later and they act cool. I'm just like, fine, I'm cool with that. Other people, maybe they avoid me now and I don't know it because I don't see them around because they're avoiding me, who cares? But I do have an awesome community through the show of listeners and guests that I can easily engage with anytime and even if we don't agree on stuff, we're respectful to each other. My Telegram group is where it's at. There's a super amazing bunch of geniuses in there that it's kind of like having a search engine where you ask humans instead of an AI questions and you get pretty good answers. So yeah, I mean, I guess to further answer the question because this is a really important topic. I don't try to be that guy that authoritatively tells people what's going on about this or that. Unless they are kind of asking for the conversation, they wanna know what I think about it and then I'll blow up into a huge flow state on it anytime. And when people around me are doing things that I don't agree with, I'm trying to find gentler ways to bring awareness to what's going on and hopefully not sound judgmental or holier than thou. And if it doesn't go over well with them, just being like, okay, it's cool, dropping it or something. It's tough, but you do get somewhere by planting seeds gradually with people that you care about, but you don't get anywhere with them if the bridge is burned. And I know that there's some cases where your boundaries require permanence or temporary permanence, but generally the biggest thing the media has ever done is divide and conquer, constantly divide and conquer. So the less we can allow for that, the better, despite the fact that some of the radical left literally hate us and want us to die. Not that I consider myself on the right. I'm just not- You're just not that. Just not down with the program or whatever. I mean, I saw a Yahoo News article. I didn't read it, but, you know, cause they're all just clickbait headlines or all that it's really for. And it was like, should we, is it time to start making life difficult for those who haven't received the poison dart? I know. Code word. [Speaker 2] (28:13 - 28:14) Yes, of course. [Speaker 1] (28:15 - 28:15) Yeah. [Speaker 2] (28:15 - 28:23) There's so many. It seems like it's like a well-coordinated campaign. Like last week, it's just been all these different MSM articles and headlines that all leaning towards the same exact thing. [Speaker 3] (28:25 - 28:31) There was one in New Zealand yesterday saying why unintelligent men are most likely to question COVID. [Speaker 1] (28:32 - 28:50) Oh, for ours, they said that it was self-centered, egocentric men that are most likely to question COVID. I saw that exact same article from one of our news sources, but they just changed up the lingo because I guess it has more impact. Yeah. [Speaker 3] (28:51 - 28:54) And they just said that way. That shows the hand more than anything, right? [Speaker 1] (28:54 - 29:02) I literally just saw that article right before I got on here in my Telegram group. And it was like the same phrasing, but with just a slightly different derogatory language. Yeah. [Speaker 2] (29:03 - 30:25) Yeah. Last year, kind of in the beginning, middle of all this, one of the articles that was going around was pretty much saying people who question masks are psychopaths. Whatever it was, it's just... I don't know. I just get a good laugh out of some of these now. And I hear what you're saying before around the journey when you're interacting with different people who think differently. Like when I was younger, I definitely was more self-righteous than like... My intro to a lot of this stuff was through health and wellness. And so I used to play the food police. I was just like, why are you drinking Red Bull? You know how many chemicals are in that shit? Or whatever the case may be. And then it's just, you get to a point where- You need to know. Yeah, you need to know. And then it gets to a point where you start learning more about what health is. It isn't just the simple fact of what you put in your body. And there's so many elements that play on it. And you just get more comfortable and secure with who you are as an individual. And so you're like, well, I'm going to do me and I'm going to live my life. And I'm going to create the life that I want with the people that I want. And you're free to make the choices that you want to make. And it's cool. You know what I mean? Like, so it's... I'm not saying that I'm perfect. I mean, I could be self-righteous. I say this all the time and things get under my skin. But when I'm in a conversation with an individual, it just goes a little differently than maybe how it would have gone 10 years ago. [Speaker 1] (30:26 - 30:41) I think- I like to say the best way to lead is not to tell people what to do, but to show them the example of the benefits of living the way that your perspective would want. You know, like walking the talk is a long-winded way of saying. [Speaker 3] (30:42 - 31:21) Yeah. I feel like when a lot of us first, you know, wake up to these discrepancies and this information and we're trying to badger other people, I think on a deeper subconscious level is kind of because we're still seeking their approval for having those opinions, right? I feel like it's because in some sense, we still haven't really developed that truth as a solid foundation. And we're still like, you know what I mean? If you see this too, then why aren't you agreeing with me in some kind of sense? Well, I know for me anyway, when I was playing the Foo Police when I was younger, on some level, I was still seeking validation for having those opinions from family members. [Speaker 1] (31:24 - 31:36) Yeah. And then there's the legitimate care for watching somebody that you like. Yeah. Drinking a Coke and going, how do you do that? So scary. [Speaker 3] (31:36 - 31:38) Yeah. But the thing is, man, that is amazing. [Speaker 1] (31:38 - 33:39) Like you said, like, I mean, I was slamming soft drinks whenever I was beginning college. Actually, my habits were so horrendous when I first started college and it was like, it led me to the dark night of the soul that I eventually clawed my way out of to make some better life for myself. It was nonstop like Mountain Dews and other energy drinks. And I gained almost 100 pounds in a little more than a year. It was tremendously bad because I was just given access to what the university food was for the dorms. And I just ate whatever I wanted and didn't think twice about all kinds of bad choices. And so I learned what an uncomfortable life was like by immediately going from being super comfortable in my body to or nearly immediately to really uncomfortable in my body. And that was tough, but I bounced back from it almost equally fast once I dealt with the things that were causing me the stress and mental anguish that was really leading to the condition of overweightness. Because I didn't improve my diet even all that much when I lost the weight. I actually like found meditation and got rid of some toxic individuals out of my life and a few things like that. And then I lost the weight. I mean, I started gradually getting more active as I went, but yeah, really it was like those things allowed some of the weight to fall off. And then I felt good enough to start doing other things that would help more of the release happen. So you can transform yourself really fast, but it was helpful for me to have had the experience of how bad it was. And I wasn't even nearly as bad off as somebody that overweight that would be older because at that point more damage is getting done over time, right? So I think I have a pretty clear inspiration to never let myself go again. And that's self-care, right? Life is just so much different. [Speaker 2] (33:40 - 34:58) Yeah. Yeah, and it's like you had the personal experience. This is what I tell people because I've experimented with certain ways of living and eating. And a lot of people for the last decade have thought it's really weird that I don't drink alcohol or I don't utilize caffeine or I don't pollute my body in certain ways that are kind of the norm for most. And what I tell them is like, well, I've been on both sides and I just love feeling awesome. I like not feeling hungover. I like having steady, consistent energy levels. I love going to sleep at a certain time. I love waking up with vitality. Like for me, that wins. Like I'd rather do that than be hungover and feel shitty and then feel shitty about myself. And then my inner critic comes in, like, why did you do that thing? And then it's like, it snowballs and gets to this place. And so through the personal experimentation process, you take in data and then hopefully you come to a conclusion where you go, all right, well, feeling awesome and great and healthy is better. But that's the process. There's a lot of psychological work that an individual has to do, self-awareness work to even get to that place of understanding. [Speaker 1] (34:58 - 35:19) So yeah. Yeah, there's people that have a really perfectly healthy body, but that for whatever programming reasons, they hate their body so much that they don't feel that vitality while eating because they're crushing their own cellular electricity with that negative self-image. [Speaker 2] (35:19 - 35:49) Yeah, and they could have an awesome body, but is it an armored body? You know what I mean? So it's just like what a person looks a certain way, just because the person looks healthy, whatever that means. Fuck, man, they dropped the dead of a heart attack at 40 years old, 50 years old. I mean, so again, there's so many different factors of what makes a person healthy. Like you said before, oh, I didn't really change much of my eating that much and I lost weight. And then that's a whole nother rabbit hole to go down on like, what is health? You know, what is health? So yeah. [Speaker 1] (35:49 - 35:53) I mean, I eventually did have to change the eating habits though, to be fair. [Speaker 2] (35:54 - 36:10) No, I got you. But I just mean like there's more to it than just that. Of course, your body's gonna give you feedback if you start eating McDonald's three times a day, you know, like it's at some point, you know, the chemicals and stuff are gonna impact you. And then hopefully you have the awareness to go, okay, I'm not gonna do that. [Speaker 1] (36:10 - 36:26) But again, My worst was like four days a week. McDonald's are more probably. Yeah, man. So brutal. Yeah. Those right there on campus, easy access, you know, those universities with those fancy medical programs that are telling us how to be healthy. [Speaker 2] (36:27 - 37:03) Yeah. And there's economics that play into it. But at the same time, when a person really looks at their life, now again, it depends. There's degrees to this. But when people are spending all this money and all this other stuff, all these monthly subscriptions, all this caffeine, all this coffee, all this other stuff, drugs or alcohol or clothes, like, you know, just at the end of the day, it comes down to priorities. And each individual is gonna decide what do I prioritize in my life. And I know what I prioritize. I prioritize health and knowledge and learning above, you know, a lot of other things. [Speaker 3] (37:03 - 37:37) But I feel like you prioritize those things because there is an element of self love there and self care, right? If you're not prioritizing those things, then it's because you're prioritizing the image, right, I guess, over that. And the thing is care, in my opinion, is intrinsically connected to responsibility because you can't really, you can't care for yourself without being responsible for yourself and your wellbeing and your health as well. And it's that element of self responsibility that we can never teach another, which is where this conversation started, right? We can only show it through practice. [Speaker 1] (37:40 - 38:31) Yeah, there's always gonna be a time when grasshopper is ready and the teacher appears and we can definitely fill that role in the right time and place when it pops up. But yeah, you have to look like a worthy teacher for people to wanna come to. And that's definitely, you know, it can be a continual, I won't say struggle, but an effort continually because there's never gonna be an end to that ladder. Life is like a giant game of chutes of ladders, really. Chutes are ladders. And for some people, they just haven't figured out that the temporary fun of sliding down the chute is not as fun as the view that you have whenever you keep climbing the ladder. [Speaker 3] (38:33 - 38:50) Yeah, nice man. Man, I feel like you're someone that has just such a diverse array of knowledge and information. So I'm gonna ask you a question. What is the coolest piece of information, knowledge, magic, whatever it is that you're into at the moment that you're learning, that you've learned? [Speaker 1] (38:52 - 45:17) I knew you were gonna ask this somehow. I had already thought of this question. Yeah, I mean, I'm super into figuring out what really happened in history and recent history. There's a lot of digging to be done when there's just like a ton of YouTube channels out there that are looking at historical artifacts or architecture and then comparing what they see there to the photographic record and to the official narrative of what happened. And so I can go through some examples of like the major- Mudflood Tartaria or that you're thinking of? Well, some people will latch onto those conclusions, but like I'm just here for the exploration of the topic because when I look into it myself in my own area, I see things that fit the patterns that YouTubers from all around the country and even around the world are exposing. So yeah, the mudflood theory is part of that. If that's relevant or not, maybe it's partially correct or who knows. But one of the things that I found recently, okay, so have you heard about the world's fairs? The world's fairs in the late 1800s and early 20th century were these wild extravaganzas of massive monolithic stone architecture. And I say monolithic because they're made carved out of one stone, but because it's just like they're massive and crazy, right? So stuff that people do not build today, you could say. And these huge campuses for these fairs would literally be constructed in a year or less according to the historical narrative. Massive buildings, gilded statues, all of it looking like it came out of Nero's Circus Maximus in ancient Rome. Huge columns, all the works, right? And then after these fairs that were happening in like every major population center of the continent and even in places outside of the continental US, the buildings were said to have been temporary and so they were destroyed. So that's like a pretty well-established vein of research. There's an episode earlier in the year on my show where I covered that pretty deeply. And it looks like, long story short, that there was some kind of civilization that preceded the European colonization of the place. That during the westward expansion of the American nation, there were like really amazing con jobs done to convince the public of a specific version of history and to erase the evidence of the previous civilization. By either destroying buildings or utilizing the buildings that were found or potentially unburied to become like government buildings, banks, universities, stuff that the Vatican owns. And that's what, when you look at the buildings that have this style, they all fit the profile of one of those, being for one of those things. And it does give a very interesting twist to the term free masonry. And maybe they found some free masonry. And anyway, so that's a pretty interesting research thread. And just the other day I found, I can't remember the name of the YouTube channel off the top of my head because it's a new one for me, but she's really amazing. I'm going to try to reach out to her. But she had uncovered that before the world's fairs, of which there were so many, there was actually a thing going on during the civil war called the sanitary fairs, which were supposedly like, they're basically the same exact setup, elaborate buildings, just a bit smaller in scale. And like arts and crafts fairs and attractions and things for the people to come visit. And it was all said to be supposedly for the raising of money to help troops who are injured or sick. And one of the commonalities between this and the world's fairs event was that at the world's fairs, the majority of the history that was going to be accepted as mainstream history for the United States was taught and given out. And books were published that were released at these fairs. And when you come down to it, there's like only a handful of names that even wrote the entire history of the United States pre-civil war. And all that information was then disseminated at these big fairs. Well, in a similar fashion during the sanitary fairs, information about what was going on in the war, the civil war was being disseminated to the people. Paintings of battle scenes and early photography, potentially. I don't know if they had it back then. I think they did have like stereotypes or however you say that. So it looks kind of like that the civil war wasn't as advertised in that it was really some kind of a conquest of existing infrastructure that wasn't under the rule of the federal government at that time and capturing cities and destroying a lot of the old architecture. And it's crazy because when you look at some of the cities that were destroyed in the South from supposedly from Union Army attacking, it was just like completely dust and rubble and huge brick and stone, massive buildings have been just reduced to nothing. And the pictures of what they looked like before that are, it looks like Dresden, Germany before the fire bombing and the resulting ashes that are left after the cannons and bullets of civil war armies were done with it. Somehow cannonballs can just basically vaporize huge stone buildings. I don't know. It looks the same as the Dresden firebombing and the so-called nuclear attacks on Japan and a bunch of other examples we can even look at in the modern day, some of the very bizarre forest fires in California in recent years. [Speaker 3] (45:17 - 45:23) And all it just has this like crazy- Was the DEW? What's that? Are you hinting towards the DEW? [Speaker 1] (45:23 - 46:57) I don't know what it's pointing towards. I don't want to jump to that conclusion necessarily. I actually would put it more on some kind of like frequency weapon. A lot of the burned up neighborhoods in California all had the smart meter and you can look at aerial photography of some of the neighborhoods that burned down and the trees are still standing but all the buildings are just dustified. And that's what it looks like in these like post San Francisco earthquake photos, Dresden firebombing, the Chicago fire, the civil war battles that supposedly destroyed big cities. The cities are rubble and dust but the trees are still standing. And a telephone, they look like telephone poles or electrical poles or whatever that have wires carrying. They are all still up but they don't have wires on them. So there's like, I still have a lot of research to do on the subject but it does seem like there was some kind of infrastructure for electricity that predated our modern use of electricity. And a lot of that was like destroyed and retrofitted and repurposed by the current conquering parasitic class. And then our history was basically written and given to us in the form of these elaborate like sanitary fairs and world's fairs. And once something's established and that's what's in the educational textbooks once we start to get mandatory public education, it's set in stone. I mean, that's what the mythology becomes fact. [Speaker 2] (46:57 - 47:24) I mean, even just look at the last, what was set in stone in March, 2020 to some degree, it's like people have just rolled with it. And like, this is it. I mean, people are still talking about six feet social distancing. Like, are you fucking kidding me? Like that's not even rooted in anything. And it's like, this is going to keep going on and people are going to be saying these things. So it's just amazing how one thing gets set in stone and then it becomes fact, you know, period in quotes. Do you remember that thing called the flu, bro? [Speaker 3] (47:25 - 47:26) Do you remember it? [Speaker 1] (47:27 - 47:33) Oh yeah. Oh yeah, the flu. Like the Spanish flu, where they told people to wear masks. [Speaker 3] (47:35 - 48:11) You think there's, sorry bro, back on that topic quickly. Like, do you think there's anything to be said for, like in your opinion, what is the reason for the destruction of that architecture? Because there seems to be definitely an encouragement of ugliness in the way that these buildings and the world is built around us compared to how it used to be, right? And there's less beauty and there's less design and there's less artistry in architecture in general. And less permanence too. Yes, absolutely. And less permanence, yeah. What do you think about that? [Speaker 1] (48:12 - 50:12) It's theorized by some people that the previous civilization had an infrastructure that not only allowed them to use electricity without cables or wires, but also to project or create fields of harmonic, like orgone rich energy. Like basically you had technology that was acoustic based, such as the organs that were in these massive cathedrals, some of which still exist. And even think about the name organ. Why is it called a pipe organ? Do those pipes have something to do with your organs and the tones that could be used as frequencies to heal and to strengthen the organs? Because cymatics study shows us that that, and sound healing proves to us that we can affect organs positively with frequencies. So I think it was largely about getting rid of that tech or repurposing it in ways that it would basically be inverted and create the deadly orgone radiation that we now see completely filling the sky. And you can literally watch the weird haze in front of the sun at all times. And I think that the DOR fields that are being projected into massive population centers through probably technologies like HAARP are actually the medium that allows for like serious excitation of people's nervous system and emotional state through different frequencies. I also think we can do something about it. It's not like doom and gloom. I have a really strong tower buster right here. And when built correctly, you can create orgone energy that's not deadly and transmute the energy of the spot you're in. Yeah. Cool, man. [Speaker 2] (50:12 - 50:37) Excuse me. Yeah. It was a question I wanted to ask and I totally forgot about it when you went on what you were saying before. So besides that thing, what are some of your solutions? Because a lot of people can get doom and gloom about things that are going on in the world, but how do you choose to live your life? What are some of the things that you focus on? [Speaker 1] (50:39 - 53:50) Well, our field, the bioplasma around us that's generated by our life activity, it has a sort of sheath or envelope at the edges just like any strong electromagnetic field has a type of barrier there. And how permeable that barrier is or how many holes in our aura we have is the degree to which outside energies can influence us negatively. So keeping ourself in coherence to the highest degree possible, as much as possible. And that's basically a fancy way of saying like, do all the things that you probably have been instructing people to do for a long time. Get grounded, do body work, get a proper nutrition, definitely get the right amount of rest. There's a lot of ways that you can up your voltage and improve the coherence of your field. And I think that it's a natural defense mechanism against externals, but there's also, we are in a war of tech in a way where a lot of what's being arrayed against us is high tech. So you can use technological means to improve that level of coherence. I do think properly constructed Oregon devices, they have the right amount of metal in them and it's layered correctly. That can help. You can also do Oregon devices that you bury around your house on your property. That can help, definitely want to put them out by like smart meters at your house or nearby cell towers. I've done some recent episodes with my friend Mitch who has been renegade style, literally putting thousands of Oregon devices around cell towers across Arizona and then around the country really, because people are ordering them from him to put out or learning how to make it from him and doing it himself. He actually got somebody that volunteered to take Oregonite and bury it at the Georgia guide zones the other day. So that place has been, had the field shifted. So stuff like that, I think does have an effect even though it's subtle energy. You, I mean, I personally learned my own feeling of subtle energy from working with crystals and Oregon devices are more powerful than that usually. So use your inner feeling, like ask yourself, is this helping? But it's not going to be the ultimate solution. Like it's really more to like bolster the stuff you're already doing. No amount of external technology will make up for being internally fractured. That's going to leave you wide open, no matter what, at least in the place where you're armored or I guess, yeah. Cause armoring is what leads to those fractures. It's like the hardening is what allows for cracks to occur. So there's also, I like tuning forks a lot. I think those are good use of technology to get yourself into a coherent state, but nothing for me beats like grounding barefoot on the grass and going on a walk or doing some Qigong. That always puts a sparkle back in my eyeballs. [Speaker 3] (53:51 - 54:31) I wanna ask you something for someone that was looking to get into crystals and understand the crystals and the impact and the energy of crystals in subtle ways, because I know it's something that a lot of people have and partake in and play with, but there's never really a direct authentic connection or a noticeable enhancement. I guess it's just more of a, I guess a surface level thing for most people. So what do you recommend in order for someone to help that wants to get into working with crystals? Where would they start and how would they begin to understand that energy? [Speaker 1] (54:32 - 54:46) It's a great, awesome question. So for me, the first crystal that I got an encounter with that made me realize, oh, there's something going on here was one called Selenite. It's really inexpensive. [Speaker 2] (54:46 - 54:46) Oh yeah. [Speaker 1] (54:47 - 54:51) I have a huge piece of it here. I got one over here that lights up. [Speaker 2] (54:51 - 55:06) We have two Selenite towers that line our healing studio and we got them at the Tucson Gem Show right before they closed. We like rolled in and he's like, all right, 40 bucks for both, dude. And they're like massive towers like before. [Speaker 1] (55:06 - 58:39) It's not that expensive. That's a really good one. And I would use it like just play with it, move it around my hands. The palm chakras can really feel it. Working with it around the head, you can almost feel like this electromagnetic bubble. It's the same type of feeling that you would start to pick up on if you were doing a lot of Qigong and working with like making energy balls between your hands and expanding them and contracting them. Very similar type of feeling. Now there are a whole bunch of different gems and crystals in the world and none of them are going to save your life or solve your problems, but many of them have claims about them that range from like wealth to communicating with aliens. So whatever you might want to use a crystal for, I will say the safest bet is that the color of the crystal could probably correlate to something to a chakras or if you learned about the composition of the, like what makes it up, quartz being silica, for example, that might inform you a little bit about some sort of bioenergetic properties that it would have and the shape of it. Like what type of shape does it grow in? That also might tell you something about it. Like with selenite, it grows in these parallel, it grows vertically in these parallel lines, like kind of rectangular or circular usually and is a super powerful transmitter of light from point A to point B. Like if you shined through one end of a selenite, like a laser dot, it would come out the other end and point on the wall perfectly clear. It's very, I think fiber optic cables were based on this type of crystal or utilize it in some way. So if there is a specific intention that you had and you wanted to work with ceremonially or in some sort of habitual way and you did get a crystal that had a core that you found to be correlated to that thing and the simpler, the better probably. Using it towards that goal would be like wrapping it into some jewelry that you could wear or carrying it with you or meditating while holding it. But the key is it's like a relationship. It's not gonna do anything for you if it doesn't have a relationship with you. And so if you kind of set it on the shelf and forget it exists, I don't think it does a whole lot in terms of its primary. I mean, because if crystals could just do whatever it is was on the tag at the rock shop, I would have all kinds of wealth and riches and abundance right now because I have a huge shelf of all kinds of different crystals because they come to me like mad. But I found that when I work with it specifically, intentionally, and keep my mind focused on the intention that is connected to the energy of that stone, then I can have really positive results with that. And so it's really about what you make of it. And as any tool, it's really just an external symbol of something you're doing for yourself. But that external symbol can be a confidence booster or reminder. They're aesthetically pleasing to have in your space. And that's one of the primary gauges of if a space is harmonious or not, aesthetically pleasing. We have that sense for a reason. [Speaker 2] (58:40 - 59:03) Yeah, I like the way you talk about this because I feel like crystals have been hijacked by the new age community in a way where it's just like, they'll just look at what it says on the label and then put it on their shelf, like you said, and then just be like, this is what's going to come to me. This is what's going to happen. And there isn't that intimate relationship that you talk about. So I'm curious what your thoughts are on that. [Speaker 1] (59:03 - 59:16) It's how all those psychic healers out there make their money to have booths at places. You got to have that crystal side hustle. Yeah, right? Yeah, so I'm sorry. What was the question before I kind of jumped in there? [Speaker 2] (59:16 - 59:33) No, I was just curious your thoughts on that in terms of how like crystals have kind of been popularized in this kind of pseudo-spiritual new agey way where, you know, yeah. Double-edged sword, ultimately. [Speaker 1] (59:34 - 1:02:32) Commodification of any resource is ultimately artificial and kind of gross. You know, even the fact that just by taking the word ray, and ray is actually a specific deity, R-E, putting that before the word source, which means nature or the origin of everything. And now it's a resource or a racehorse. And a racehorse, we use these resources to fuel our rat race. And it never really takes us anywhere but a more corrupted place. Because by pretending that what came from nature in the first place is something to commoditize and own and profit off of, you're kind of missing. I mean, not that commerce is inherently evil, but the way that these things are slung, like you said, it's like, it'll cure your herpes. But it doesn't, you know, people are really probably disappointed by that. And so I think that that does have like a gross taste to it. But ultimately, we're also generally playing for the monopoly dollars to go to the big magic rectangle that has all the food in it. And so I can't cast too much shade for that. I think that there's probably some really, like I've actually, I once went to a crystal psychic, where she had a bag of crystals, and you drew one out. And then she would give you like an Oracle reading based on what stone you took out. And that was actually really cool. And then I went and got myself one, not from her, but one of the stones that, or the stone that I drew. And it was like a useful tool at that time because it symbolized something I was wanting to achieve. So there's definitely good to it. I think it exposes the fact that there are metaphysical qualities attached to stones would cause maybe an entry level starry eyed new ager to then be led to learn about maybe like the chakras or the way that emotions correlate to different physical states, like how our root chakra security, poor gut health can lead us to feel like, or can manifest situations in our external world insecurity of our living space or not having a home. There's all these connections that you might be led to, but there's a lot of ways to be led there through learning about crystals. So it's like a, it's up and down, but do we have the right to go like mine things out of the earth? Was it there for a reason? Kind of think the earth is a body, but on the other hand, a lot of the stuff is already out and circulating. So are you doing direct harm by buying one of these things? I don't think so, but there is exploitation at parts of the journey for sure. Enjoy this moment, enjoy the moment. That's because you're not all caffeinated, like ready to hop to the next thing. [Speaker 2] (1:02:32 - 1:02:42) No, I haven't had caffeine in eight and a half years and I didn't have chocolate for eight years, but about a few months ago, I was like, you know what? I fucking want some chocolate. So I'm gonna have some chocolate. [Speaker 3] (1:02:42 - 1:02:43) It's hardcore, right? [Speaker 2] (1:02:45 - 1:03:53) Yeah, well, you know, yeah, in eight years. I had no stimulants or depressants at all. Nothing that would kind of, but it wasn't like out of restriction. I just got to a point where that was part of my journey and I really enjoyed it. And then things shifted and evolved and keep learning more and more about health. And it was like, I think I really enjoyed chocolate when I was younger and I wanna have some chocolate right now. So I'm gonna have some. Anyways, but I'm trying to, this is what I wanna ask you is that we've experienced these last 17 months and there's so many theories people can talk about, like what's happening, what's going on. This is the result of a decades long plan. Though, because of your wide range of research and your understanding of technology and the occult, where do you think we're moving towards? People very often talk about this trans humanistic technocratic world society or we're gonna be slaves. Like, what do you think is the end result? And where are we going? [Speaker 1] (1:03:55 - 1:03:57) Oh man, you want like my real thoughts on it? [Speaker 2] (1:03:58 - 1:04:31) No, I want you to be here for the half truth or here for the lies. All right. Yeah, real thoughts, man. And it could be doom and gloom or not just share what's off your mind. Like, again, you exemplify, and I think we all do is this truth seeking process that I talk about often. It's a fucking process. We like throw shit at the wall. We take things in. We let them marinate. We think about them in a certain way. Like we're having a fucking conversation here, you know, and some people are gonna be into it. They're gonna be like, hey, look at these three guys talking about some fucking crystals. It's a weird ass shit and technocratic. It's trans humanistic and whatever the fuck's gonna come out. You're next. [Speaker 1] (1:04:31 - 1:04:32) I love the mix in this show. [Speaker 2] (1:04:32 - 1:04:38) This is like very me. So yeah, man. So yeah, tell us your real thoughts. [Speaker 1] (1:04:39 - 1:12:13) Okay, well, I think it's the technocracy the transhuman agenda, if you will. I think it's the externalization of something that's already spells that have already been cast on humanity or hexes that have already been cast on humanity on their spiritual level or on their inner level. I'll see if I can explain this in a concise way. But the inner battle that's been going on for humanity for a long time has been between the, you know, your independent individuated self, what your soul signed up here to do, like why you wanted to incarnate in the first place. Your deepest, most radical wish has been at odds with the wishes that have been programmed into us from society. And I just read this amazing book that I can't believe I hadn't read earlier. The Never Ending Story. The movie does no justice. The book itself is like life-changing, super enlightening. And anyway, one of the biggest themes in that book was showing through the story how the more wishes that we pursue and fulfill that are not our own authentic deepest personal wish, the more of ourselves we lose to achieve that goal. The more of our self gets cut away to the point where the inner world can become basically void and empty. And the usefulness of any vessel is in its emptiness. So there's a paradox here because moving closer to personal individuation and enlightenment and your deepest personal wish, your self's ultimate wish, if you will, is also like an emptying of the vessel. You're emptying all the parts that didn't fit or serve you anymore. And you're making your vessel useful by bringing it into clarity. But then there's like a dark emptiness, if you will, that is kind of like, it's the same thing as the void in the sense that on the one side, your inner vessel is empty but filled with light. And on the other side, it becomes filled with darkness because there's so much crammed in there that doesn't belong. That is blocking out the light completely. And so at which point it becomes like a void as well. But this stuff on the negative side is like, I am legion. It is that the more empty of selfhood or evacuated you are from your own experience of reality that is being so distracted or so armored or so out of love with life that you're no longer even paying attention. That's like leaving the controls for something else to come in and drive. So this is sort of like where attachment comes in or demonic possession comes in. I think people have been prepped as vessels for demonic energies for many generations and have been utilized that way pretty well by the statist elite, whoever is running the show at any given century. Assuming that even history is correct. Maybe it hasn't been going on that long at all. And we've been sold a bill of lies, but we believe it because it's got, it's been fact-checked or whatever. So this has been like the alchemical transmutation of the human mind to a lowered state that's been going on for a long time. But now I think there's a new game or like a final maneuver of the evil version of the great work, which is to by making people completely sterile and sterilizing human beings and moving us further and further into artificiality as a way of life and potentially to the end game goal of humans being grown in test tubes rather than ever having natural birth. I think there's possible, I don't know if it's actually doable, but there's all kinds of stories of enlightened masters, Taoist wizards, whoever. I mean, maybe they're true, maybe they're not. But there are stories of like very powerful beings able to just let their, take their consciousness out of their body, either for out-of-body experiences or just leave it entirely and choose when they leave the body and die. Like that's the power of the enlightened. You actually choose your death and you leave on purpose. And on the other side of the coin, my research into this stuff lately has led me to, like, I'm very skeptical of a lot of stuff, but what years of research in this topic has led me to think is that maybe it's possible for an entity of the dark, if you will, to jump from one body into another body and maybe by creating these sort of clone style test tube human beings, and maybe this has already been done in the past, and that was something that happened in one of the previous great resets. Maybe civilizations do get completely wiped out and replaced with like grown humans. And that's where the idea of genetically modified humans to begin with comes from. But basically, I think what, if this makes sense, like by creating human beings without natural birth, by getting more and more dependent on artificial things to keep our life artificially extended, we are creating empty vessels for something else to fill. It's like consciousness and energy are one and the same in my perspective. I think consciousness, attention flows, or energy flows where attention is directed. This is all proof of the fact that like any basic energy or primary energy of creation or from imagination, wherever it comes from, is itself conscious, but it takes on the consciousness, which means the feeling of what it's like to be whatever shape of container it's in. So first of all, we're making our vessels less and less of a natural shape or have a natural resonance or frequency. The more artificial stuff is put into us or that we willingly take into us, like all the graphene oxide that's in the poison darts, which is a fascinating development to find out about. And the media has all kinds of articles from the last couple of years talking about how graphene oxide is actually good for you. And if you inject it into your brain directly, it will help you with depression. So there's something going on here where our containers are being distorted and warped so that a different type of conscious energy can live in them. And this is akin to like invasion of the body snatchers that potentially some other form of intelligence that exists beyond the veil of materiality is seeking to enter this world through us and is successfully doing so in a lot of cases, but also finding that the resistance is strong from people like us that won't abuse our temple and we'll leave it a place and purify it so that the most high can dwell within. [Speaker 2] (1:12:16 - 1:12:38) Great answer, dude. I want to be like, bro, how many tabs of acid have you had in your life, man? No, I'm just like with you, dude. I love it. I totally agree with a lot of the things you're saying, dude. And there's only certain kinds of people that can take that in and even have space to like contemplate and think about these things. You know what I mean? It's so beyond. [Speaker 1] (1:12:39 - 1:12:42) I think I did it maybe five times total. Okay, cool. [Speaker 3] (1:12:43 - 1:13:24) Look, man, to me on an esoteric level, it makes sense. And it links a lot with soul embodiment, right? And if the whole agenda is to have us vacate our body in a number of ways through externalizing and outsourcing, then I mean, even on a general health level, right? That's how parasites enter. It's because we're not there. We're not cultivating that energy in our body in that area, right? So as above, so below, as within, so without. My question is, so then would that mean that in your opinion, that these forces that wish to enter through us are also the perpetrators, right? [Speaker 1] (1:13:27 - 1:16:28) Well, yes and no. I think one of the most important truths I've ever realized is that free will is the basis of the existence of life. Like Tesserion talks about this too, that spirit is freedom, that they're actually like synonymous terms. And ironically, the highest level of freedom is doing almost the predestined thing that your spirit intends for your life. So who knows, is that like another layer of the exact same thing we're talking about? Are the Buddhists right that there is no actual self and we're actually just puppets of forces beyond our control? I don't really think so. I think that free will is the deepest part of our existence. That's why they're always harvesting our consent in a million different ways, however they can. And because there are harsh consequences in natural law to breaking a free will, any of these parasites need to convince the being that they are wanted and needed. In any form, like the gut bacteria that you have that wanna eat sugar convince you that eating more sugar is a good idea, right? It works on all the octaves, all the levels. So we could say that the parasites are the perpetrators, but we could also say that it's the ones that let the vampires in that are equally complicit. Because no matter what a voice in your head tells you to do or any authority figure tells you to do, the one who follows those orders and does the wrong action and violates free will is the one who suffers the karmic consequence of that behavior. So that's sort of the white magic of it all is that generally the technocracy is moving us forward through consent-based compliance and revelation of the method and the non-resistance that they receive as they unveil further parts of the plan day in and day out. One year they're saying geoengineering doesn't exist and climate change is gonna kill us all. And then the next year they're telling us that we're actually gonna block out the sun with geoengineering and geoengineering is great. It's just a slow, I can't remember the name of the effect. There's like a specific name for this, but the consent is harvested by presenting something in the media that is not acceptable and continuing to present it until it gradually becomes more acceptable and continuing to present it until it becomes what's demanded or seen as the norm. And this is the tiptoeing march that tyrants have always taken us on. And it's been, I think the deepest levels of the occult, especially that sorcerers would use against humanity. It's generally just a deep understanding of cosmic and human psychology. [Speaker 3] (1:16:30 - 1:17:37) Yep. Well said. I can, yeah, in my experience, I can definitely speak experientially to the whole idea of, you know what I mean? Consents and free will being the primary crux because for me to get to where I am, I had to do some deep revoking and some deep revocations around some programs that I took on, you know, like religiously and whatnot. And in the process of me revoking that and me, you mean, asserting that I am, that no other entity shall inhabit my space and deprogramming these ideas that I took on, I felt a noticeable difference once I was finally able to rid myself of these ideas that I took on. So time to throw that in there, man. So yeah, I think you're right. Consents is what's being coerced and is what is keeping most of us from really understanding how powerful we actually are. [Speaker 2] (1:17:39 - 1:18:02) Cool. Okay. So I want to jump in a completely different direction just because, you know, we have a little bit of time left and it's something I know you've spoken about on Unslaved and I feel like you've said something on your Instagram page, but I want to get your opinion on this subject. I'm curious if you can read my mind and you know what subject I'm going to ask you about right now. Kenny? [Speaker 1] (1:18:03 - 1:18:06) I'm going to guess it has to do with cryptocurrency. [Speaker 2] (1:18:07 - 1:18:36) There it is. I'm good. I'm so good. See, look, we just like showed an example in real time of like healing and mind reading and intuition and connection. So thank you for passing the test. And I thought you're pinging it over into my brain. I was like, ding. I did. I was pinging it over. Yeah. So what are your views on crypto? Pros, cons, things to look out for, you know, another vehicle to control humanity. Thoughts? [Speaker 1] (1:18:37 - 1:29:59) I have a lot of thoughts on this. Maybe controversial, probably depending. You know, the best expression is the one that like pisses off both sides, right? Cool. Yeah, exactly. The fun thing is that you can always get a glimpse of what things are about by looking into the language. And the word crypto, if you Google it, the first definition that comes up is an adherent to a secret pledge or creed, typically communism. And that's like paraphrasing the definition. Maybe Google's changed it, but I have videos where I show this Google search. So that's a slang word that crypto is a slang word that used to refer to people who are secretly a communist. And the thing about, there's so many things about cryptocurrency, like it's crypt. A crypt is an underground vault for the dead. The entire legal system, that the occult aspect of the legal system has to do with creating dead artificial entities and getting people to identify as them. This is actually the on paper version of demonic possession because the sorcerers understand that if you want an outcome, then you need to layer a ritual across many different levels of the field, octaves of the field that reflect the same idea. So our legal status as citizens or legal persons, that is an artificial dead entity, just only existing on paper and in the imagination. Because in reality, what we are is a verb or an unfolding process, not a specific person, place or thing. In fact, nouns don't exist. They're entirely abstract and conceptual. Any name is just a conceptual mouth sound that refers to something that does exist. And any place is just a jurisdiction invented by imaginary boundaries that someone decided on or a group of people decided on. So when you realize that really deep aspect of your being, that what you are is just what you were becoming in that moment and you're not a specific thing or a specific person, it allows you to jettison a lot of other programs that are going on like voting or what have you. And with crypto, this is another example of one of those programs because money has been gradually moved from the realm of reality to the realm of artificiality over the course of time. The actual original definition of money referred to wealth or precious metals specifically. That was what meant money. And later we started to use the word money for fiat currency, which has nothing to do with being backed up by anything physical. You know, money is still a conceptual abstract value if you're using gold or silver, but at least it has real world existence and tangible indestructibility. Whereas the further we go into a digital conceptualization of how we wanna play Monopoly, the more different levels of like configuration hell that we must enter. Because I see like the technocracy failing just based on the fact that it's so difficult to keep complex networks going. That's why if there's like re-skilling camps after the communist takeover where they send you a re-education, they'll probably teach you how to code so that you can help keep all the 5G, internet of things, internet of bodies going. But in reality, I don't think it's gonna go that well. I think what we should really be preparing for is the gradual collapse of things as a transition or great reset doesn't go according to plan because not enough people go along with it. And the best way to prepare for that is to just get as much actual wealth as possible, which wealth is anything physical and tangible that brings prosperity or happiness. So that could be like actual land or the ability to have sovereign control over resources that you need like water and food. All these things could possibly be challenged by a future regime change. Maybe now you don't own the land or something, but most likely the collapse will not allow for a lot of organization from controllers to come cause problems for people that are getting themselves unattached from the grid. And so crypto could be a useful tool for somebody to build up real world sovereignty by turning their crypto profits towards that goal. But if you're only... Man, I call it video game money because the first version of cryptocurrency I remember was way back in high school when Xbox Live became a thing and you could play Halo on the internet and you could buy like Xbox Live bucks for real money. And then you spend those points to buy in-game purchases in the digital world. And I think our generation, especially a lot of the younger men who are super heavy into crypto have grown up playing video games or having an idea of artificial currencies already deeply ingrained that they would have some kind of value. Like the huge MMORPG that millions played over the last decade, World of Warcraft actually had, probably still does have an entire economy of people from Asia making in-game money by playing the game repetitively just to make video game money and then selling that for US dollars online. Like this is the same concept but we've just taken all of like the orcs and the swords and the magic out of it and now it's literally just you and the numbers and it's a casino Royale. It's just another... Any profit that people make on crypto is similar to the stock market. Someone has to lose for you to win. So it's not a very good system in that sense either. Now, could you use crypto as a currency for some sort of community that you wanted to build by your own rules? Absolutely, you could use a system like that. It doesn't inherently have to be evil to use a type of artificial digital currency. We just need to know that the further removed from reality we get, the less any value there is in the thing that we're pretending has value. Because if you got dropped in the middle of the Sahara desert tomorrow and you came across some uncontacted tribe but you've got your cell phone and your Bitcoin, I don't think you're going to be able to trade with them. Luckily, they'll probably help you out because they're still wild human beings or they might just kill you because you look like one of those crazy people from the matrix. I don't know, but either way you can't eat it and it doesn't have any physical existence and if the systems holding it were to go away, it would all be moot anyway. So I get that there are some safeguards with certain coins and ways of storing your crypto that would protect it from internet outages or this, that or the other thing. But the fact remains that this is the most quick adoption of any technology I think that's ever happened. And it's very bizarre how hard the push for adoption is just coinciding with all of the economic collapse that's been engineered by the great reset. To me, it seems like you're just setting the stage for the next layer of control which is the whole Bill Gates patented implants that will monitor your bodily activity and you generate currency for doing the right things and thinking the right thoughts and watching the right ads and then it's a universal basic income system but it's based on your merit as a worker be drone. And if you don't spend that money, within like, I don't know, a few month period, it will cease to exist. So just furthering the intensification of the divide between the haves and have nots because with fiat you had, when people were in debt or are in debt in our current system, there's interest on the debt. So the debt grows the longer that you have the debt. And on the other side of the coin, the wealthy have always had the compounding interest scheme going for their bank accounts where just by having a lot of money in the bank, they make money off of that money every year and not even to count all the different rigged casino games that the super wealthy play with the stock market that as soon as Reddit tries to jump in and goof on with the GameStop thing, no, no, no, you can't do that. You can't actually win in here. So to me, it's just another setup for a rigged game. And there are some people that have got more, you know, well thought out ways of doing a digital currency that's more private and more protected. And I applaud that direction. But at the end of the day, it's gonna be like the big XRP Peter Thiel bullshit coin that will probably or Bitcoin itself that will probably become a type of standard. And it's just a matter of time until it's GovCoin and it's got a big old familiar G on it and we know where it came from. And it's just another layer of, I mean, this artificiality question. When you think about living in a digital existence, you're literally no different than a cartoon because a cartoon is just a series of images that have a timestamp attached to them so that when looked at in order, it creates the illusion of life or movement. And in the same way, all the records of your movement through GPS tracking, all the texts that you send, all of the bank statements that have a timestamp of when you made this purchase at this place, all of that to a sophisticated AI paints a picture of who you are that it then knows you better than you know yourself in some respect. And it's just gonna get more weird the way things are gonna be tailored to people's experiences in the digital world will be tailored to the direction that the AI knows that they're vulnerable to shooting themselves in the foot. And not that the AI itself is actually, that's just a phrase. I don't really think there's an actual independent intelligence. I think it's like, there might be a form of consciousness for these elaborate machines if energy and consciousness are the same and you're building a container that's a closed loop system for that energy to exist in. The electricity is powering these huge server farms that the alphabet agencies have got. Maybe there is a type of entity living in that, but it's not the same as you or I because we have an open type of system that connects us to the background energy or the source energy of the cosmos where whenever you're building these artificial vessels to house this artificial intelligence, it's a closed system and it requires sort of like a vampire, an external energy source to keep it operating. And it doesn't have any form of, it can't itself self-perpetuate, self-replicate. It doesn't have any of the actual qualities of life, which is to continually exist and self-generate. It's kind of a long rant. [Speaker 3] (1:30:00 - 1:30:02) I think you're on point. [Speaker 2] (1:30:02 - 1:30:02) I'm here for it. [Speaker 3] (1:30:03 - 1:30:39) I think you're on point, man. To me, I agree. It's obviously in the direction of artificiality and you're right. How people don't question how quickly adopted this has been, how implanted this was, blows my mind sometimes. Yeah, of course you can make money and I guess develop sovereignty by playing the game or whatnot. But from a higher perspective, of course this is lockstep with the overarching agenda. From where I'm looking anyway now, I really, really appreciate that answer and that explanation. I think anyone that listens to what you just shared will get a lot out of that and resonate with that. [Speaker 2] (1:30:40 - 1:30:52) Yeah, I agree. And like anything, it's a tool and how do you use it to the degree that you do? Like you said, get that money and then buy some land, buy some guns, buy some seeds, buy some gold, buy some silver. [Speaker 1] (1:30:52 - 1:31:05) Move out of California? Yeah, well- Like my buddy Joe is a really good crypto wizard, but he's literally forced to go that route just so he can afford to get his family out of California. [Speaker 2] (1:31:05 - 1:31:20) Well, we moved to California, dude. So we live in California. We moved from Santa Monica to Topanga. So we have a little bit of a... Topanga is kind of its own little world. We're on some land but we're still in California. So we'll see what happens, man. [Speaker 1] (1:31:20 - 1:31:31) Well, you know, you're away from the major hysteria centers of big population groups. Yeah, we definitely are. I think that's the good move is to avoid big cities. [Speaker 2] (1:31:31 - 1:31:42) Yeah, I hear you there. Cool. It's been a great episode, man. Yeah, it's been good, man. It's really good having you here. I love just kind of flowing where the conversation took us. [Speaker 3] (1:31:42 - 1:31:46) I love it, bro. Magic, healing, crystals, crypto. [Speaker 2] (1:31:47 - 1:31:48) I think that's the title right there. [Speaker 1] (1:31:48 - 1:31:54) Magic, healing, crystals, crypto. What'd you say? I'm no expert on crypto. You know, I looked at it more from the... [Speaker 2] (1:31:54 - 1:32:34) What the fuck's expert? You know, honestly, like that term, it's like we just see experts say. Experts have concluded, you know, like we're human beings having the experience, investigating, learning and having a dialogue, you know? People can watch this. Maybe they're really into crypto and they'll say, fuck you guys. I made millions of dollars. Y'all can eat a dick. You know, whatever. We're having a dialogue and that's all good, man. So, you know, I don't think no need to discount like whether you're an expert or not, like you drop some wisdom, you drop some knowledge, you could be wrong or you could be right or you could be somewhere in between. And that right there is what we're here for. [Speaker 1] (1:32:35 - 1:33:16) And me and my buddy, Dylan Sicosio, who I recommend his book, Spirit World. Incredible book series. It's a spirit world as in W-H-I-R-L-E-D. Very deep three-parter. And we had a conversation on my show and on Unslaved. We did sort of similar information on both. And we talked about this exact question of what is money versus wealth versus actual prosperity? And what is cryptocurrency and all that? So if you want to further explore those questions, you should find that on my YouTube channel from earlier this year. I think the episode is called What Is Money with Dylan Sicosio. Awesome. [Speaker 2] (1:33:17 - 1:33:24) Anything else you want to like, where can people find you? People that are watching this, Innerverse, any socials you want to share? [Speaker 1] (1:33:25 - 1:33:37) Yeah, I sometimes I'm active on Instagram. Lately, I've just been really hitting up Telegram because I have such an awesome group going and nobody gets censored. So that's pretty cool. [Speaker 2] (1:33:37 - 1:33:38) You got a highly active chat. [Speaker 1] (1:33:39 - 1:33:43) Yeah, it's always popping off. I can barely keep up. I stopped trying to. [Speaker 2] (1:33:43 - 1:33:45) There's too many things going on. [Speaker 1] (1:33:46 - 1:35:41) Yeah, but it's fun to hop in and out of there, ask questions, answer questions, look at funny memes and stuff that goes on. But my website, innerversepodcast.com, you can find links to all the different places where you can check it out. If you happen to be a Rockfin member, R-O-K-F-I-N, you can get the premium version of my show, the extended episodes, or you can get, because I do a one hour show for free every week and a two hour, a second hour extension for members. So they can get that on Patreon or on Rockfin. And other than that, I'm looking to, in the very near future, start opening up my schedule more to do one-on-one work with people. And how that will manifest is probably going to be unique to the individual. But I do have a lot of experience with the etching and some pretty good proficiency with Tarot as well. I can teach Qigong moves that would be helpful and visualizations and meditations that can help people disconnect from potentially energy vampires in their life, strengthen their field, do biofield tuning with tuning forks. I've got a lot of different possible modalities I could get into with people, or we could just have a guidance session where you talk to me about what you want to talk about. So you can email me for that. My email address is on my website. Message me on Telegram or on Instagram. That would work. Oh, yeah. You know what? I wanted to... Do we have time for me to ask you a question? Yeah, sure. Why not, dude? Okay. You brought up my human design and you said we had the same setup in a way. Will you explain what that is? I haven't really had human design explained to me. You don't have to go super deep into my setup, but tell me a little bit about my human design. Is that okay? [Speaker 2] (1:35:41 - 1:37:53) I won't go too deep into it, but we were again, once again, on the same page because I was about to jump in and say that the I Ching is one of the four, let's call it ancient sciences, that is part of human design. You have a nine-century Hindu chakra system. You have Western astrology. You have the Kabbalah Tree of Life and the I Ching. But what I wanted to share with you is that your incarnation cross, also known as the life theme in human design, is the interpersonal life theme of healing. You actually have the same incarnation cross as Wilhelm Reich, which is really cool. And I'm just going to read a little bit from this because I could talk about your profile. I could talk about your type as a manifesting generator. I could talk about your authority as emotional authority, et cetera, et cetera. But I just want to read this one paragraph for you. And perhaps someone that's listening is going to be interested in this. And obviously, if you're interested, you can reach out to me. I give human design readings. Joel's into human design and is telescopic. He's onto that too. But I want to read this to you, okay? Your interpersonal life theme. This is your theme. Your purpose in life is to bring healing to the world. This may come about indirectly, such as possibly by becoming sick yourself and inspiring others through your own healing journey. Whether you were conscious of this effect, you bring a healing energy to others everywhere you go through your deep love and compassion. Sometimes simply walking through a room can trigger healing in those people around you. In this regard, you must take responsibility for your own well-being. Otherwise, you will become overloaded by other people's dis-ease, becoming depleted and even unwell yourself. You might think it is your responsibility to heal the whole world. But if you attempt this, you will become exhausted and unable to assist anyone. Remember that sometimes the simplest healing takes place through everyone, especially you, lightening up and having a good laugh. There's more to this, but we'll just share that paragraph with you. [Speaker 1] (1:37:54 - 1:38:19) Wow, man, that's pretty deep. Yeah, that's a point. Definitely have had like, you know, feeling of it being important for me to find a way to help the world heal from where it's at. That's always been deep down why I'm doing what I'm doing. And I've also learned the lesson, but it's a continual step-by-step that the only way that that happens is if I take care of myself. And then it's automatic. [Speaker 2] (1:38:20 - 1:38:20) Yeah. [Speaker 1] (1:38:20 - 1:38:26) So that's pretty cool. That resonated. So awesome. I didn't know it was the same as Reich. He's a badass. [Speaker 3] (1:38:26 - 1:38:36) Yeah. Before you jumped in with that, I was going to bring in your telescopic numerology. I'm sure you might be familiar with the system, but you're aware that you're a two, right? [Speaker 1] (1:38:37 - 1:38:43) Nah, I don't know a lot about my telescopic. I've been wanting to get signed up for that too. [Speaker 3] (1:38:43 - 1:39:52) In the telescopic system, the numerology is dictated by a 10-day period, which you were born to. So the ancient Egyptians charted 36 constellations, which rule 10 degrees, as opposed to 12 constellations, which rule 30 degrees. And so the period that you were born in is actually ruled by the two. And specifically, the 36 constellations are matched by the 36 cards of the minor arcana. So the two of ones. Ones being fire coming from the Aries. And this just speaks so much to everything that you've shared, because two is all about having numerous key areas of interest, right? Deciding what areas to focus on, working with others, cooperation, confederation. And the challenges, which is something that we speaked of earlier, is that you're prone to impulsive changes and obstacles for you are gonna be overcome when your ambition is directed, right? So in your process of developing those practices in grounding and disciplining yourself to actually direct your ambition, this speaks to the theme of your numerology beautifully and perfectly. So yeah, just want to throw that in there. [Speaker 1] (1:39:52 - 1:40:02) That is so cool. I intend to learn telescopes. I have a friend in my Telegram group, Ryan, who is really deep into it as well. Seems awesome. [Speaker 3] (1:40:02 - 1:40:30) Oh yeah, it is, man. And it's been such a pleasure having you here, dude. I really, really appreciate it. I really appreciate the depth that you come from when we discuss these topics. You really do see the bigger, I guess, and deeper esoteric picture to most things. And that's something that I really resonate with. And keep doing your thing, my bro. It's such a pleasure to meet you. And look forward to doing it again sometime down the road, you know? [Speaker 1] (1:40:31 - 1:40:41) Absolutely. Honored to be here with you guys. Really good to meet you, Joel. Awesome to catch up with you, Erasmus. Of course, brother. Tons of fun. Can't wait to share it with the people. Cool, dude. [Speaker 3] (1:40:42 - 1:41:00) Thanks for listening to Hear for the Truth. We appreciate you guys too. Thanks for being here. And we'll catch you next time. Take care, everyone. Bye. Smoke and mirrors, I'm seeing through the illusion. Waking up in a time they think you're in a delusion. Somebody set the alarms, cause AB2 is each news and I'm in a delirium.