Mike Wilkerson Exploring Geological Mysteries

[Speaker 2] (0:00 - 0:24) Welcome everybody back to the Here for the Truth podcast. My name is Joel Rafiti. Got my co-host Erasmus with me as always. Today, we welcome Mike Wilkerson, otherwise known as Stellium7. From being the first person jailed for computer trespass to exploring ancient history, biogeology, and unconventional theories, Mike's story is one of curiosity, rebellion, and paradigm-challenging discoveries. [Speaker 1] (0:25 - 0:43) So, come join us in this episode as we explore some of his very unique theories, including one that many of the rocks and large geological formations that we see are potentially petrified remains of ancient gigantic creatures and biological parts from the past. [Speaker 2] (0:44 - 1:05) Again, the conspiracy theorists, the history buffs, anyone that's into our podcast with an open and active mind is going to want to come along for this ride. Erasmus and I, you know, we're Switzerland. We're kind of neutral here. We're still getting our feet wet, understanding which is which, but we're here for the truth, here for the conversations. [Speaker 1] (1:06 - 2:38) Yeah, I think that's like what I said later in the episode. It's like, well, I'm here for these conversations, man. Like, we have to check where our mind's at. We have to check again why we believe what we believe. Now, that doesn't mean we just let anything in and run with it and say, I staked my flag in the ground. I saw one video. I saw one podcast. Now this is what's happening. No, but entertain it. You know, push up against your edges. Go, oh, man, that's fucking stupid. Wait, why do I think that's stupid? Could it be true? Could it not be true? Like, we have to be able to do this with a lot of things that come into our field and our thought process. Yeah, for sure. I'm more Swiss on some issues than other issues and other issues. You know, I'm very much so. I feel I've got a bit more certainty around. For those that know me and are part of my community, like, you know, I'm openly a flat earth skeptic. Right. You know, it seems as though through this episode, Mike, it definitely leans more in that direction. And that's cool, too. I'm not saying I know for sure by any means whatsoever, but it's interesting. And, you know, where there's interest, there's curiosity. So, you know, let this episode land, however it does for you. And whichever way the cookie crumbles, there's no doubt that he has points to make. And this is an interesting episode. Yeah. And also, too, just a reminder, if you get a chance, like, feel free to go to our website to watch this, because Mike shares a bunch of photos to back up things that he's talking about, especially like from a geological standpoint. So it's kind of pretty cool to see some of these formations and then his theories around it. [Speaker 3] (2:39 - 2:46) You are now listening to the Year for the Truth podcast, hosted by Joel Rafiti and Yerasimos. [Speaker 2] (2:49 - 3:51) For over a decade, Mike Wilkerson has worked as a chiropractor in Spain, where his mission has been to help improve health, one spine and one mind at a time. Mike has always asked unconventional questions. As a teen computer hobbyist turned hacker in the early 80s, his thirst for deeper knowledge led to wild adventures with some of the top hackers in the nation. In 1985, the fun ended with brief incarceration for his infiltration of computer servers at Microsoft and three other Seattle corporations. His interest in examining the unquestionable, however, never weighed. In the decades that followed, Mike evolved from mischievous hacker to benevolent backcracker. And in recent years, an independent researcher with emphasis on non-standard cosmologies, alternative hidden history, gigantism, catastrophism, rapid petrification, and what he has taken to calling biogeology. His research and presentations are available on the Stellium 7 YouTube channel. [Speaker 1] (3:52 - 4:01) Mike, thanks for being here for the truth. Thanks for the invite. It's a pleasure to be here. Absolute pleasure, man. It's good to have you here. [Speaker 2] (4:01 - 4:16) One way we always like to kick off these conversations is in your own words and whatever comes up intuitively that's ready to be shared here and now. What are some of the major rites of passages and, you know, catalyzing moments in your life that really steered you in this direction? [Speaker 1] (4:17 - 19:43) Well, you mentioned one of them in that intro, which is the whole hacking experience that I had, which really lasted for about five years. I was from 13 to 18 until I got busted. I was doing that pretty much whenever I could. So, that was a very interesting chapter of my life. I started just out of curiosity, interested in video games, and I knew that computers were what made video games tick. So, I got into computers, simple stuff like, you know, basic programs at the library and on the computers that they had that were available to the public. And then eventually got a computer of my own and a modem and started to learn how to connect to things like bulletin boards and learned later about stuff like the ARPANET, which was the backbone to what we call the internet today, which was universities and think tanks and military industrial complex organizations all networked through this decentralized network that had been created that now the internet sits on. So, I was playing around with all that kind of stuff when I was in my teens. And then, sorry, I'm just getting over a cold. So, I may have to clear my throat a lot. Yeah. And then that led me to seek out the others. And I started to get to know different hackers around the nation. And we were collaborating and sharing information. And it's a lot like what people call the truth or community today was happening back then in the early 80s. And it wasn't just computers that we were using, but people were gaming the telephone systems as well. So, we knew how to make free calls and conference calls and do all kinds of wild stuff with the telephone networks. So, we were doing late night conference calling when I was 14 and 15 and staying up all night and falling asleep with people still talking, you know, next to the phone. So, I got to meet a lot of really interesting people. And it was kind of an anarchistic sort of group, you know, rebels that weren't order followers and weren't afraid to dig into all kinds of unusual subjects. And so, that kind of ingrained my personality. Where do you think that came from with you? Like, you know, obviously we have this unique part that is ours, you know, that we all come in with. And yet, of course, there is conditioning. There is, okay, maybe our parents had an influence. Like, where do you think this came from? Yeah, my parents had a huge influence. They were both very alternative. They were the new agey types, you know, before it was new age. They were, I would say they were true hippies, not the, not the, you know, drugs and free love kind of hippies. But, you know, they were really into Eastern religion, Eastern philosophy, meditation, that sort of thing. My mom was an astrologer. I grew up with things like the Tarot and the I Ching and astrology as part of my daily life. The old new age. Yeah, yeah. And my mom was very much the black sheep of her family with these interests, because, you know, it was kind of a Judeo-Christian family in general, very middle class mainstream. And she was the odd one out in many respects. So, she kind of grew up a rebel. And I adopted that as my, you know, to somber on day too. And my father was out of the picture from a pretty early age when they were separated by the time I was one. And he was never really in the picture, except for just, you know, some weekends on occasion. And later in life, I developed a friendship with him. But he was also a very unusual guy, an artist into all of those other things that I just mentioned. They were part of the, you know, transcendental meditation for a while. And my mom went on another path with her discipleship, following a guru. So, I was always curious about philosophy and Eastern philosophy in particular, curious about religion and what people thought about the nature of God. And at the age of 10, I was going to church just on my own accord, because I saw people going in and out of the church that was in my neighborhood. I was like, what are they talking about in there? And so, I went in and started to learn about the Bible a little bit, and memorize the 10 commandments in order to get a free Bible. And, you know, went around on their joy bus where they would sing their Christian songs. And it didn't, like, resonates so much with me that I wanted to continue, but it was just something that I was open-minded to. And then also, I grew up very alternative when it came to things like diet. I was a vegetarian. I had a very unusual name. My name was Princeton when I was younger. And everyone called me Prince for short. And so, when I entered into grade school, we moved. I grew up in Southern California. I lived very, very briefly in Topanga, and then also, like, around the Malibu area, Hawthorne. You know, my parents were both from Gardena. They went to high school there, and they bounced all around the valley. And my first five years, we lived in a ton of different places. But eventually, we moved to Ojai, and I grew up in Ojai. But at seven years old, coming to a new town, the new kid, I was the smallest kid in the school. I was a vegetarian. I had long hair. I had a weird name that was really easy to mock because everyone just called me Princess because of the long hair. So, before long, I'd cut my hair off and change my name. And I picked a name that I liked the sound of that was one of the most common names I could think of that I thought no one will be able to make fun of that. I was wrong. I found ways. And then, yeah, so that's kind of how it began for me as far as my rebelliousness. And then in junior high school, I ran into some trouble, got on the wrong side of a kid who spread some rumors about me that really spread like wildfire. And next thing I knew, I was basically everyone's kicking posts. And I became a target for the next three years of my life, basically. And that was definitely a rite of passage to have to go through that at that age, especially based on completely false pretenses. Like I was accused of being gay, and that I'd been caught masturbating in one of the bathrooms in the metal shop, which is a complete lie. At that point, as an only child, and I didn't have any older siblings, I didn't even have friends that were older than me, most of my friends were younger than me in the neighborhood. So, I had no idea that I didn't even know what masturbation was. So, that was how I found out because people were like, all of a sudden, we are making these gestures and calling me names. And I'm like, I didn't even know what happened. It was literally like from one day to the next, my whole life changed. So, when computers came around, I lost myself in sport. I played a lot of tennis, I played soccer for seven years. And I love the team sports. And then also, you know, tennis, just because I could do my own thing. And then, forgot where I was going with that. But yeah, and then the computers, that was my respite. You know, I spent a lot of time in my room, learning how they worked, telecommunications. And then eventually, I had a whole social world. Like we do now with the internet, you can have friends all over the world who you never even meet in person. That was my life. The difference was, I started meeting them in person. I was flying around the country. And we were having these hack cons, which are these little, you know, not conventions, really. It was just a bunch of guys getting together in a house somewhere and talking about computers and playing video games. But those literally morphed into what became DEF CON. So, it was a really interesting beginning. And the guys that I was hanging out with, I didn't really understand. I knew they were good. But I didn't know until 30 years later, when I started to write a book about the experiences, that I'd been hanging out with the top hackers of the day. They were like my friends. So, they're part of hacker lore. If you go online and you're curious about the 80s hacking scene, that was my life for several years until I got busted. I remember when I was younger, I loved the movie Hackers. I don't know how truthful that was or sensationalized. But what... We loved to mock it because they made some real glaring mistakes with the tech in that movie. But we also loved it. And we loved that it kind of brought it to the forefront of mainstream consciousness. Obviously, along with that came a major backlash, which was the Computer Fraud and Crime Act of 1986, which made it a real hardcore crime. And I was basically the test case for not that law because that was past the year after I was busted. A lot of people are like, when they hear my story, they're like, was War Games based on you? I even kind of look like him a little bit when I was younger. But I was actually involved in hacking for a couple of years before that movie came out. So, is it true that you were... I definitely identified with it. Were you the first person incarcerated for, quote unquote, computer trespass? Is that correct? Yes. It's a strange, dubious honor. But yeah, I was in Seattle. I just turned 18, two weeks before I got caught. And there was a new law on the books. Only one other person had been prosecuted under the law. And it made it a felony offense for computer crime, they could prove that it was in the first degree, which means premeditated with intent to defraud. They weren't able to prove that with me. And I didn't end up with felony offenses. They were just gross misdemeanors. But I had the good fortune, sarcastically, of having my prosecuting attorney who was assigned to the case was one of the two people who penned that law. So, he had a vested interest in not just a conviction, but also jail time. He pushed really hard for that. So, I was a first time offender. I was young. I did some stuff that was sketchy. And, you know, there was some theft involved and stuff, not computer related, but other things that I go into in detail on the book. But, you know, I wasn't a malicious hacker in any way. And I wasn't stealing information from any of the companies. And they weren't able to find anything or to, you know, try and hit me with that. So, they focused entirely on the computer stuff because they wanted to send a message to the outer world, like, hey, don't do this. You're going to get in trouble if you do this. And so, that was me. I was the test case and I went to jail. And and if you look on Wikipedia, you'll find me there, a little blurb about it. And then there's a table at the bottom. And if you sort by sentencing date, I'm not the first hacker on the list. I'm the second, but I'm the first to do jail time. So, how long did you spend in jail? It was, well, I was, I was sentenced to two weeks and then it was dropped to one week because the jail that they put me in for safety, they didn't want to put me in the county jail. King County is pretty, pretty nasty jail, especially for a guy that looked like he was, I looked like I was about 14 or 15 at the time. I was very, I had a youthful face at 18. And so, they put me in basically, it was a real jail with, you know, the thick metal doors and, you know, but it was essentially a holding cell for, for lighter crimes like DUIs and that sort of thing. So, I went once they realized that that was, I was going to have to pay to be in the jail because it was like staying in a hotel. The judge decided to lower it by a week. So, I spent a week there. And yeah. All right. So, not too long. That's good. Not too long. No, I'm not, I wouldn't, I'm not what you would call a hardened criminal. Well, I guess moving on from that into like your interest for like ancient history and what you've coined biogeology and things like that, like how did those interests begin to prop up for you? About nine, 10 years ago, I started to dig into a lot of subjects that had to do with things like mind control and the influence that secret societies were having on our reality and how they were using things like music and television and movies to basically shape culture. And it was a really profound awakening for me because it pulled at the threads of my entire reality. And it looped back into a lot of things that I took for granted as being organic developments, like the 60s as a whole. You know, I just assumed that, that the story of the 60s was what we were told. And I didn't realize that, that in many ways, it was more of a cultural rollout than something that developed organically. And that applies to the ideologies and to the music and to the, you know, the usage of psychedelics. And so, in what way was that rolled out from your opinion based on your research? Yeah, such an interesting topic. I'd love to touch on it. It's a gargantuan topic. We could talk for hours and hours on just that. But I think, you know, you have to look into, you have to understand how the intelligence agencies and mind control is well documented and declassified and is used to shape public perception. And music plays deeply into that with organizations like Tavistock. The whole New Age movement, in my opinion, is that to a large degree. And that includes your places that a lot of the illuminaries that we, you know, the authors and the people that we look to when it comes to the 60s, a lot of those people have ties to intelligence or to occult organizations. And it's in much too high a percentage for there to be some kind of, there's a there there, you know. [Speaker 3] (19:44 - 19:46) Now, a short break from the episode. [Speaker 2] (19:47 - 20:26) A recent testimonial from Chris McCormick, who just finished the last round of Rise Above the Herd, round nine. He says, I had reached a glass ceiling and couldn't get beyond the mediocrity of my life that had become overwhelming. This course shattered the glass ceiling into smithereens and provided extremely well thought through steps, knowledge, and experiences to enable progress. The level of detail revealed around the insidious programming we humans have been subjected to allows for a quantum jump in understanding and ability to take one's power back like never before. There is life before Rise Above the Herd, and there is life after. The two are very different. [Speaker 1] (20:26 - 20:38) Just make sure you do the work and keep going. Thank you so much, Chris, for that incredible feedback. We absolutely love having you inside Rise Above the Herd and getting to know you and witness your evolution. [Speaker 2] (20:39 - 21:07) From July 3, The Doors to Rise Above the Herd round 10, which now is officially a 10-week program, we've moved on from the eight weeks. We've added extra modules, extra integration calls, extra nervous system workshops. The Doors are open July 3. If you would like to become one of the 15 individuals who partakes on this journey and this next iteration of Rise Above the Herd, you can head to riseabovetheherd.co to sign up and claim your spot. [Speaker 3] (21:09 - 21:10) Back to the episode. [Speaker 1] (21:11 - 32:49) Going back to your original question about how I got onto the subject of things like biogeology and catastrophism and alternative cosmologies, I was waking up to that. I was going through a psychedelic renaissance of my own at that time because in my 20s, I experimented a lot with psychedelics and theogens, gestogens, whatever you want to call them. There's a lot of different names for them. There are a lot of narratives that are pushed. I read many books on the subject before I ever experimented. I was 19 before I even smoked pot for the first time. I avoided drugs like the plague. Through my youth, my mom had me convinced that it was much better to take the natural route. If you get to some amazing place doing it naturally, then you know how to get back, but if you're just catapulted there by some kind of a substance that alters your brain chemistry, then you don't know what you're getting yourself into either. I had a lot of really profound experiences. My first experience was pretty mild. It was with mushrooms. I wanted to have a more profound experience the second time. The friend who had introduced me to the mushrooms gave me another bag and told me to take those. Those will get you off. I thought he meant the whole bag. My second experience with psychedelics at 19, I think it was, maybe 20, was beyond a heroic dose. It was probably enough for six people. And that's a whole story in and of itself. There were a lot of really profound insights and revelations that I had from those experiences. I had read many books on the subject that were really the seminal classics of the day on the subject of psychedelics and spirituality. And I assumed that a lot of that information was true. It never occurred to me that there might be agendas behind those words and that people who were purveying that information were actually working for other organizations that had an interest in changing our minds. Is this closely tied into the Ram Dass and Timothy Leary Harvard experiments? Do you feel like they're connected to some of the manipulation? Oh yeah, absolutely. Well, I can't speak about Ram Dass, but I know for a fact that Tim Leary was CIA. He worked for the CIA. He helped them. I think he even wrote their intake questionnaires. This guy was also a devout follower of Aleister Crowley. There are videos online on YouTube of him talking about how he considered himself to be continuing the great works of Aleister Crowley. It was for people who don't know, a very, very dark occultist who is probably one of the most influential people of the last century that a lot of our current reality has been based on his teachings because so many of the elite in media and government and different different, the power structures are very much followers of his ideology. So there were a lot of names along the way that, and for people who are interested in this kind of subject, a starting point might be something like Strange Scenes in the Canyon, which is a book by a man named Dave McGowan. And he's talking about Laurel Canyon and all the weirdness that happened there in the 60s. There was a CIA base there. A lot of the super bands came out of that canyon as well. A lot of the music that we probably all know and love. And as he dug into the past of these people, he found that there was way too many connections that didn't make sense mathematically when you consider odds. So yeah, and that's what I meant by the whole tapestry of my reality started to unravel as I dug into that. And that was after I had gone through my own psychedelic renaissance because I was convinced that the way forward for humanity was psychedelics and that that was the only way we were going to shock ourselves out of this nightmare escape that we're living in when it comes to how everything is run and done. So, I had a number of experiences with ayahuasca. I had a whole book outlined and planned that I wanted to write on the subject of the archaic revival. And I started to, after some epiphanies that I had in one such experience, I've started to, I just had this realization that caused me to start to look into the occult and how it tied into Disney. And that was just a profoundly deep rabbit hole that I never expected because I was a huge fan of Disney, pushed it on my children growing up, love to go to Disneyland. You know, I've got some amazing stories to tell from there and ask Mike Winner about that. Talked to Xerof for two hours in Mexico at Anarcopulco about one of those. The adventures of Mike and Mike in Disneyland. That's a story. Yeah. He used to work there. So, he was like riveted the whole time because he could envision every little nook and cranny of it that I was talking about. You grew up in that area. Yeah, you're right. Yeah. Yeah. So, we had a lot and he's also a gaucho. He went to UCSB like I did. So, we were there at the same time and didn't know each other, but yeah. So, and then, you know, to just bring back around right at that time when I'm having all these epiphanies, that's when I met a guy named Alex Michael. Some might know him as conspiracy music guru. He wasn't conspiracy music guru yet at that time. He was just a guy like me who was interested in a lot of different conspiracies. And when 9-11 rolled around, I was wide awake to it from the beginning because I'd already been reading the works of David Icke. And another one of those rite of passage moments was when I was 22, my dad gave me two books, one of Behold the Pale Horse by William Cooper and another one called The Emperor Wears No Clothes, which was all about the whole conspiracy related to the prohibition of marijuana. And, you know, a lot of people still refer to Behold the Pale Horse. It's like one of the Bibles of conspiracy investigation. So, I was hip to that at 22, 23, 24, already looking at the symbology of everything from corporate logos to, you know, I knew about all these different secret societies. I knew about the ones that weren't even secret, but were all these intertwined interlocking organizations that were the power structure of our world, which still are. So, it was kind of a period of, there was some darkness and paranoia there. I continued like running off to the, I contemplated running off to the hills and decided not to because I realized that, well, if I take myself out of the game, then I can't influence the game at all. You know, it's like, yeah, I can live nicely in a cabin, but eventually the, you know, the fascist boot comes, you know, to all the doors if people don't stand up to oppression. So, yeah. So, we were comparing notes, Alex, Michael, and I, and just checking off the boxes. Oh, you dug into that one. You dug into that one. You dug, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then he started, then he brought up Flat Earth. And I thought, this guy, oh, I believe he just went there and there's no way. I thought he was intelligent. I, you know, he's clearly smart, but if you're willing to believe something that absurd, then, you know, you've got no discernment and you're willing to believe anything. So, I thought, okay, I got to take everything he says from now, from now on with a grain of salt. And I just ignored it. And, you know, kind of smiled and he said goodbye. And he and his wife came as patients to my clinic originally. That's how we met. And then the next time I saw him again, he brought it up. He's like, hey, did you look into that? And I was like, so I got to go debunk him now. And I figured it would take me about five minutes. I find a live feed from the ISS, some pictures of the earth. And one by one, he just shot down everything I brought. And he did it in a way that made sense. And I started to, wait a minute, these are composite photos. It says so right on NASA's website. Why? I said, okay, well, they can't get far enough away. Well, if they can't get far enough away, then why is the curve so exaggerated when you look at the live streams from the ISS? They're using a fisheye lens. You know, so I was like, it was really challenging for me because I'd already had this complete, the carpet had already been pulled out from under me because of my own investigations into all these other things that we were just talking about. And then he comes along with this. And so, it was really kind of a shaky time, but it was also really exciting because I realized, wow, you know, I knew that you can pull back the veil with psychedelics. And there are a lot of people that want us to think that that's just a phenomenon that's happening in the brain, that these other realms don't really exist. It's just a trick of the mind because the brain chemistry is altered. I knew from my own experiences that wasn't the case because my imagination could not have come up with some of the things that I experienced. So, it was, you know, now reality, not just beyond the veil, but here and now, even that was up for grabs. And I started really diving into things. I loved math in high school. I studied a lot of, you know, I was really good with geometry. And so, when I started looking into earth curve formulas and distance proofs and all of these sorts of things, I was like, it's just one thing after another. And I couldn't find real evidence in support of what I grew up absolutely believing. I was a total sci-fi fanboy with Star Trek and Star Wars. And, you know, I'd seen every episode and tried to push them on my kids. I figured, okay, I'm not going to start with next generation, which they probably would have liked. Instead, I started with the old stuff because I figured, okay, we're going to go through, we're going to work our way forward. And I started with the first Star Trek. They laughed me out of the room. They were like, this is the dumbest thing I've ever seen. This is ridiculous. Look at that. You can tell it's like hanging from wires. It's like, yeah, kind of like NASA, you know? So, they were hip to the bullshit right away. So, how did that lead to getting into fucking giant trees and five mountains that are elephants and stones that are hearts? We could get into the meat of this stuff. [Speaker 3] (32:50 - 32:50) I know your audience was like, who is this wacko? [Speaker 1] (32:51 - 47:00) Why did you invite him on? No, no, no, man. What I want to say is this. I just want to highlight, obviously, our guests know this, our guests and people in our audience. We're here for the truth, man. We're down to have all types of conversations. And I think you highlight something that's really important. It's like, can you expand your mind, have an active mind, a critical mind, and be open enough to challenge things? Now, whether or not we're right on certain things or not, I think the important thing is, is that we move beyond this conditioned, conventional way of thinking where whatever is called to us from so-called authorities, we just take as true. And so, I think that's the important thing. Now, of course, discernment comes into play. There are lots of crazy conspiracies, lots of things going out there. People get lost in them. But I think this is an important thing. So, I mean, I love having these conversations. When I met you at Anarchapulco, I mean, I've heard of gigantism, but when you started mentioning mountains that potentially, according to you, are large, massive elephants, I was like, whoa, this is wild. So, you know, and it's interesting. That's a hard one for people to swallow if they haven't seen any of the research. Yeah. In fact, my presentation in Anarchapulco had nothing to do with that. Well, I had everything to do with it, but I didn't touch on my own research at all there. I was looking at what is the evidence, what are the data points for the potential existence of titanic trees. I got onto that about, what was it, eight years ago or so when there was a video that circulated called No Forests on Flat Earth, where they were looking at structures like Devil's Tower in Wyoming, this big stump looking formation, which we're told is cooling lava. When you look at lava, you don't see it cooling like that ever. It doesn't cool on hexagonal columns unless you want to believe the mainstream geological narrative, which they can't really prove with any kind of empirical evidence. They talk about doing the science, but it's not something that you can witness happening, even though we still have active volcanoes to this day. I'm not suggesting that that's a tree. I lean towards tree. There are other theories. I've presented those theories extensively on my channel. The live stream tab is a good place to go for a kind of synthesis of all of the work because some of this takes a lot of time to present. It doesn't lend itself well to soundbites because you come off sounding like an idiot, you know, giant mountains that are giant elephants. This is a wonderful intellectual exercise. It shouldn't be such a taboo to even ponder. Oh, we've known this for 500 years. You must be a retard if you're going to consider these subjects. We question the science on that. I think that's the wrong approach. It's interesting. We should be looking at this stuff and pondering and asking questions and debating and seeing if there's any merit to the arguments. Everything is to steer us away and to shy away. Then we start to look at the actual supposed proofs for things like our globe. You find out they're really flimsy and actually that the empirical evidence contradicts the claim. It shouldn't be like that. There should be mountains of evidence that support the heliocentric model. If you really dig into with intellectual honesty and discernment, you'll struggle to find a shred of actual real evidence. That's something I didn't even talk about on my channel for the first three years. Flat Earth was like a crack the brain open on that one. Then this whole concept of like, wow, maybe these giant trees exist. I thought, wow, that's interesting. Our mythologies talk about that. I didn't even know about books like the Book of Enoch and the Book of Jasher where they actually talk about the giants, the titans going to work at the great trees and bringing them down. That had to be done before God flooded the realm if you want to believe the biblical narrative, because otherwise, the evildoers that God was trying to purge would have just climbed the trees and the flood wouldn't have affected them. It's like, wait a minute, why do we have all these stories and why do we have our myths of things like Paul Bunyan and his ox and he's going around North America chopping down the giant trees and Jack and the Beanstalk? It's like Avatar, the best-selling movie of all time for many years. What is that? It's another planet, safe to talk about it on another planet, but what was there? Gigantic trees, which an evil force from outside is coming to cut down so they can make use of the resource. These are interesting ideas that we're told are mythology, are fantasy, and what if that's our real paths? If you start to open up to the possibility that the earth isn't what we thought it is, then you should be open-minded enough to contemplate these other things as well. For me, I didn't jump headfirst into the subject like, I'm a believer, I've heard all I need to know. Now, I thought I'm going to approach this very methodically from a scientific perspective because I've got a background in higher education. I've got a bachelor's degree from the University of California and I'm a chiropractor. I went through five years of education for chiropractic. I speak four languages. I did my master's thesis on spinal manipulation technique and its effects on visceral disease. Very, very difficult, complex subject. This is a literature study. We had five pages of peer-reviewed studies in our index. I didn't one day just wake up and think, the earth is flat and that mountain over there that looks a hell of a lot like an elephant, it is an elephant. I'm like, well, once again, here's another interesting intellectual exercise. I've coined the term biogeology, but initially, I was exposed to the work of a guy named Roger Spurr and another one named Alan. They both have YouTube channels and they were talking about mud fossils and nephorensics. This is like the fallen angels, the Nephilim. Basically, the idea that a lot of the stones that we see in the world, if not all of them are, except for volcanic, because you can see volcanoes creating that kind of stone, are the remains of former beings of different sizes. Our size, small rodents and animals, all the way up to titanic beings. There was some videos that I saw from Roger Spurr where he's talking about this giant dragon in the Sahara Desert, which is about 1,000 miles long, supposedly mentioned in some of the ancient Greek texts. I can't remember which one of the Greek philosophers talked about this great battle between the Leviathan and the behemoth that took place, guess where? Right in Northern Africa, where Roger Spurr is on Google Earth and showing, look, there's the gullet and you can see the spine and there's the plumes of the serpent and here it is attacking the, I can't remember which one's with the Leviathan or the behemoth, but the dragon is attacking this giant fish. Well, it makes no sense in a globe model based on an earth to size they tell us. It's just ridiculous. He's put all of his theories into this heliocentric model, which I think doesn't work and it just makes his work look foolish. But I thought, wait a minute, the earth is not what we were told and it was much bigger, much broader or a completely different shape than maybe, and that was what got me on the mountain here in Spain because it's in my backyard and I've hiked all over it for the last 12 years and it looks a hell of a lot like an elephant from multiple different angles. And so, I thought, wait, I got on Google Earth and I start looking around and tilting it and looking at different angles and that was really when, you know, it was Pandora's box, the rabbit hole opened up and I started finding correlation after correlation, all these anomalous specific things that lined up with the idea that this might have once been a great creature. So, that was how my channel began. I did a six-part series called Unveiling a Titan. First one, people can skip because we've already covered that. It's probably my worst video because it's the first one I ever did. There's a whole bunch of pictures and ideas in there that I would totally frame differently now, but parts two through six are definitely worth watching. And if you think I'm just like a harebrained fool, then watch that series and comment in the comments after you've seen them and let me know what you think because truly honest people, intellectually honest, will give each idea its day in the sun. And if you just hand wave, dismiss something without actually investigating it, that's just proof of indoctrination. So, that's how it began. Do you have images on hand of this elephant mountain that you could share briefly? Yeah. Cool. Yeah, I can do that. While you do that, I'm just so blown away, man. Again, the humility I think an individual needs to have on this path, living this life, not having all the answers. You know what I mean? The certainty people exist with, they spend their days, moving through their days with certainty about so many things and so many issues, it blows my mind. And I mean, I understand why, when you think about our academic system, but anyways, back to you. Yeah. So, the reason I took to calling it biogeology, some people have criticized me because they think I'm trying to steal Roger's thunder, calls his stuff mud fossils. And the idea basically being that when different types of flesh or different creatures are buried in mud, that preserves the flesh so that it doesn't get eaten away by larvae and bacteria long enough so that the minerals that are in the surrounding mud can work their way into the flesh and that creates this petrification. And that's kind of similar to the mainstream model, which is called paramineralization. Everyone knows that petrified trees exist, trees are biology, but yet the petrified tree is stone. So, they don't talk about transmutation of elements where one element has changed over to another, they talk about a replacement. And that's what paramineralization is, is that the gas and the water has worked its way out of the tissues while the surrounding mineral content has slowly over millions and millions of years worked its way into the tissues. And that's how these things are being preserved. And we only find soft tissue in the rarest of circumstances that's preserved in that fashion, according to the mainstream. But we've also, I call it paradigm blindness, we've all grown up in this model where we're told these things over and over again. That's what we're told is the reason that we don't find soft tissue is that it's all been dissolved beforehand. And so, the paradigm blindness is a term I coined for when we have these belief structures in place and so we don't see what's playing in front of our eyes. And there are lots and lots of rocky structures around the world, I can show some amazing pictures in a moment, that are... When you look at the mainstream model, which tells us that all of the rock that we find is made from dying creatures and wildlife that have compressed over millions and millions of years and created these sedimentary layers. And then you have tectonic activity, which is causing these different plates to collide. And then they go upward and that's what's creating our mountains and those layers of strata which can be any which way. And then the pieces of those layers break off and then those tumble around and erode in rivers and through water erosion and whatnot. And that's how we're told all of these stones that we see are formed. And so, when you look at something and go, wow, that looks pretty damn fleshy, you don't think of it as, yeah, it was once the flesh of a creature and maybe you're not seeing the whole creature, maybe you're seeing just a part of it, maybe you can't even imagine how big that creature was. But nobody's going around thinking it's a fossil. We just think of fossils as like the skeletons and the dinosaurs and then the rare anomalous occurrence where we find some kind of petrified soft tissue. But in my presentations, I've shown there are many, many examples of all kinds of anomalous finds of rapid petrification where things are found in the process of devouring another creature and they're both petrified, right? Or creatures in the process of giving birth to other creatures. They're examples of artificial petrification. [Speaker 2] (47:00 - 47:05) I might have missed the explanation of this, but how does rapid petrification occur? [Speaker 1] (47:05 - 47:19) What is happening when an animal is mid-activity, then all of a sudden there is this rapid petrification? Well, in the mainstream, they would tell you it doesn't. So, there are theories, but they're not accepted knowledge theories. [Speaker 2] (47:19 - 47:20) And what's your view? [Speaker 1] (47:20 - 54:21) I believe, I've come to understand, I have a slide show. Let me go back to, why do things petrify? So, I just described the first one, mainstream, but we also have examples of heat and freezing, high mineral content waters, which is, there's a cave called Mother Shipton's Cave in the UK where people go and they hang objects from ropes and high mineral content water flows down and basically encases these different objects in a mineral layer and that eventually works its way in and those things become solid. There's a lake called Lake Natron that is really high content mineral waters as well, and the creatures fall in and they die because the waters are so caustic and they don't come out. And then I've got pictures of, there's a photographer that's gone and will fish these creatures out while they're still somewhat soft and he's manipulated them for photography. There's, I've got videos talking about plasma petrification, like people don't realize this, but you can create things like rubies in a matter of seconds. You know, when we talk about the hardness scale, you've got diamond at the top of the hardness scale, and then just below that is ruby and sapphire and, or sorry, ruby and emerald, which are colored diamonds in my opinion, you know, basically you've, these are things that we're told are forming over millions of years through compression of matter, but you can take in a microwave, you can take two different powders, mix them together with a bit of steel wool and put it inside of a ceramic crucible. And in 10 seconds, you can make rubies. I've got a video on my channel that's a clip from another channel where this guy is doing this live. So we don't really think about, think how, you know, opals can be created artificially in laboratories. And so lightning plasma is one volcanic ash. When ash is mixed with seawater, you've got salt and you've got the ash that can start to permeate these objects. So that's another form. Biological and chemical transmutation as well. Our bodies are transmuting elements all the time. A chicken does it every day when it lays an egg because the eggshell has more calcium than the chicken is consuming. So that's crazy. They tell us that's not possible in the periodic table of elements where elements can be fused together to create another element. We're told that only happens in suns or in, you know, like nuclear fission reactor kind of situations. And it's just false. So biological transmutation is a very real thing. There's a guy named Louis Chevron, K-E-R-V-R-A-N, who's written a book on biological transmutation. So yeah, does that answer your question? For now, a little bit. As much of it as I've understood. Yeah. So let me just show you some things that I think don't make any sense, you know, based on our mainstream geological model. You're thinking about those layers, you know, compressing and then tilting upward and then breaking off. Like, how do you explain things like what you're seeing on the screen in that model? Now, what I'm going to present are data points. And each and every one of these is like something that should make you go, hmm. But when presented, you know, when those are presented to the mainstream, they will find an explanation for each and every one of them. But the question you have to ask yourself is, how many far-fetched explanations do you have to accept in order to keep buying the mainstream model? Or are your eyes not deceiving you and what you're seeing is something that's biological rather than came about through some kind of random chance? So I'm not making claims about any of these. I'm just showing them as examples. These are what are known as concretions. They have these concentric rings. They come in very different styles. Sometimes they're just layered, but they're still perfect spheres, but they're layered, kind of like this rock you see here. And if, oh, there we go, little pointer, laser pointer. Now you can see, right? My pointer. So if you notice, these lines are, it's not just in this rock, they're continuing and they go up all the way over here. So this is wild. You've got all these different shapes they're forming, but then you have these incredibly complex layers. Like how does that work in the mainstream model of tectonic activity? To me, this is far easier to explain as something that grew biologically. A lot of people see things like this and they think, oh, bacon, you know, this is called banded iron. And so what we have to believe is not only did the layering happen, but it was very malleable and pliable so that it created all of these swirls. And then it did one thing and then it changed to a completely, when I say it, the earth, did one thing, changed to another thing, went back to the thing it was doing before, changed it, you know, it's like, and it starts to be kind of farfetched when you see it. These are salt mountains. So for you, what we're looking at in terms of these mountains is like ancient biology, preaches potentially. I coined the term biogeology because I felt that mud fossils was far too narrow a term. Yeah. I wasn't stealing his thunder. I thought, okay, that can explain certain phenomenon, but I was coming across all kinds of things that didn't make any sense based on mud fossil theory. So I think biogeology, and the only reason I, you know, we shouldn't have to use, if there's, if I'm right about any of this stuff, we shouldn't have to use this term. Geology should be the term, but if major cornerstones of the geological narrative are wrong, then we have to distinguish from that in some way. So I think biogeology is great because it's biological geology. And then mud fossils would be, it'd be an umbrella term and mud fossils would be one of the things under that. I think it's a theory that is far overapplied by many people. That channel that I mentioned has a pretty big following. So these are marble caves and you can see here concentric rings. How does that work when you're talking about, you know, layering and compression and tectonic activity? Makes no sense whatsoever. These are marble caves in Patagonia. These two, these are salt here and here. [Speaker 2] (54:22 - 54:41) Yeah. But see, the thing is like, for me as someone who doesn't know the mainstream narrative, like, or your perspective on it, like when I see like images like this of the concentric rings and rocks, et cetera, like I just think, isn't that just the nature of the rock? You know, as opposed to this being explained through it being, you know, something, a creature, biological, et cetera. [Speaker 1] (54:42 - 54:43) What would you say to that? [Speaker 2] (54:43 - 54:43) Yeah. [Speaker 1] (54:43 - 57:28) It is the nature of the rock. The question is how did it come about? You know, I don't, I'm not denying it. It's presence. It's, it's there to see. Like, what if it's always been that way? Like, what if that has been the nature of rocks on earth? You know, and that's just what it is. When you look at, when you look at the mainstream model, let me just go back to, let's see, where is it? Here we go. You know, this is what we're told. Yeah. You know, we're talking about timelines of hundreds of millions of years here. And, and so that is a, you know, that, that's what, that's what we're all taught to accept as just indisputable established fact. This is what I was talking about before the, the rock cycle. So basically sedimentary rock becomes metamorphic rock because these layers become so heavy and the pressure becomes so great that this starts to melt. And that's what gives us our things like granite and marble and that sort of stuff, the much harder stones, they're harder and yet they have all these swirls in them. So how, how does that happen? Well, that's, that's how they explain it is that there's this melt that's occurred. And then as that pressure becomes greater and greater, it becomes magma. And then that eventually gets pushed up. We call that volcanic activity, and then it becomes igneous rock. So that's the, the cycle of petrogenesis. And you can see it a little, little more beautifully there. But, but there are different ways in which that theory has been pretty thoroughly debunked and by, by geologists, but it's not, of course, going to be recognized by mainstream geology. There's a geologist who showed that after Mount St. Helens erupted, that, that huge slurry flows created these, these layers of sedimentary rock that, that happened in a matter of hours. So you've got all this micro fine layering. And normally they would look at those layers and they would tell us like that first image I showed of, of all the timelines. And they would say, oh, this is Jurassic, and this is Pleistocene, and this is that, and we know how old it is based on the fossils that we, we find in there. But you also find circular reasoning where they say, we know how old the fossils are because of the layer of, of rock that we found them. And, and, and yet that's pretty, pretty up for grabs when you realize that volcanic activity can create what should be millions of years of layering in a matter of hours. So how can they make these claims when they haven't actually witnessed it, when they can't go back in time, when there's no manipulable variable to which they can apply the scientific method to prove one way or another that, that yeah, this is actually how it happens. [Speaker 3] (57:29 - 57:29) Yeah. [Speaker 1] (57:29 - 1:06:01) Mike, in your opinion, what are crystals? Like, you know, crystals, crystals grow undeniably. I've got one video that I showed on my channel that you can basically take a tiny crystal and you can suspend it in a solution. And within a matter of 40 to 60 days, you can have a crystal that's big enough to hold in your hands. There are all kinds of ways to artificially create crystals. And then crystals themselves, like when we see geodes, you have this, this space with a hole in the center and crystals are growing inwards. So like, you know, if you think of a geode as like a petrified coconut, you know, you have the meat of the coconut. Well, a fresh coconut has very little meat. And then as that coconut is maturing, there's less and less milk and more and more meat, right? And you could think of a crystal happening the same way. In fact, there are old turn of the century newspaper articles of them finding petrified coconuts, petrified all kinds of stuff. And very often it involves crystal. So I, in my theories that have to do with biogeology, I basically, the conclusion that I've come to is that fat petrifies to crystal. And things like sap in trees, things like our fatty tissues, whether it's a fat or the fascia or the nervous system, the brain is almost entirely fat, the eyes are almost entirely fat except for the water. I believe that each and every one of those substances, depending on the conditions, can petrify into different kinds of crystal. But quartz is the most prevalent mineral on the earth and it's everywhere. So that would make sense if geology is really biogeology because all the creatures that walk around and all the trees and everything, they've all got this in them and when it petrifies, then it would probably become some form of crystal. I have a theory that is called boiled egg theory. Wait, before I get to that, let me just show you a couple of things here. These are things that originally got me on this topic, you know, this whole subject of mud floods and Tartaria and star forts and that sort of thing. This is the video I mentioned before, there are no forests on flat earth where they start talking about the stumps. And what I said at the very beginning of my presentation in Mexico is that the stumps are a data point. They're an important bit of information because they look so much like trees. But a lot of people will disregard the hypothesis because, you know, oh, porphyry faunalite doesn't form in that way and geological this and that and the other thing. So I'm undecided about this. I lean towards trees with these things because they look a hell of a lot like it, but they might be formed in another fashion. Real quickly, when I look at these photos, they look like, okay, you know, I just chopped down a tree. So depending on the size of that, is there a being that large that's coming around with a massive axe that's like, I'm chopping down a tree? You mean being like Paul Bunyan? Yeah. So I've got a video on my channel called Belling Titanic Trees. And it's touching on this subject of like, if those were trees, what took them down? What happened? And, you know, you've got the mythological narratives of like the glittering sword of God. You've got the Nephilim going, you know, not the Nephilim, but the, you know, the fallen angels corrupting the realm. And then the titans go to work at the trees. I think it was the titans. I can't remember. Where do you draw the line in terms of what mythology you take as real and what mythology you take as not? And how do you begin to discern that process? When it comes to all that stuff, I don't know. I just see it as data points. And I'm like, is this forming a cohesive pattern that actually makes sense? Do all these different crazy little bits of information, do I have to do mental gymnastics and bend over backwards to try and make them all fit together? Or do they dovetail beautifully? And the answer is yes, they do. And so that's when I start to think, okay, then maybe there's something to this. But I'm not pushing a narrative. I'm not claiming, you know, unequivocally that this is fact. This is when the penny dropped for me when it came to the subject of the mountain here in Spain, which I'll get to next, this video by J Dreamers. He was basically synthesizing a lot of these different ideas. And then he showed these two photographs. And I realized, wow, those look a hell of a lot like elephants. This is an island in Maui, or just off the coast of Maui. You can get on Google Earth and you can tilt and you can look around. It looks like an elephant from every angle. Is it an elephant? I don't know. I've never been there. I've never investigated it. If it were a creature, it shouldn't all be one kind of stone because we have so many different kinds of tissues. And each one of those tissues should petrify in a different fashion, right? And so, before you start making outlandish claims about something, you better have a lot of evidence. Otherwise, you're just going to look like a fool. And that's what I knew already when I started to look into this mountain in Spain. This is Monaco. And it's known affectionately as the elephant. There used to be a restaurant here called the elephant and their logo was the mountain. And you've got this cave structure that's right where an eye socket should be. And if you look at the creature and you let your imagination run wild and think of this, it looks like an elephant on its stomach with a head tilted back. And there's a plateau that stretches out where the trunk would be. And here, you can see that this is actually shaped like an eye socket. And when I started to ponder this, I was like, there's just no way. And I got on Google Earth and I started looking at it and I realized that this mountain, it's got a deep canyon right between where the legs would be. It looks like there's a spine. You've got what appeared to be a rib cage. And then I started to find thing after thing after thing. Is there a matching cave on the other side for the other eye socket? No. And it's a great question. So, if you look here, you can see that this section has fallen away. And actually, there's a big geological survey that was done on the mountain that I came across early on because I had the exact same question like, where's the other eye? Where's the other ear? If there's an ear on one side, we can get to that in a second. And the thing is, that portion, even in the mainstream geological model, is said to have collapsed and formed what's known as a synclinal. So, basically, when you get layers of strata collapse, they curve like this. And so, they were talking about that and I realized, okay, well, they're saying that whole section has collapsed. So, some might say, oh, that's convenient. There's no second eye. It just happened to collapse. Or that's what happened. And it's also interesting that we take the mainstream model to justify certain things and we neglect that we get rid of it for other things, which is also something that needs to come into the picture as well. Yeah. Definitely. And here, you can see the shape of the head. And then right here, there's a curve where the head would meet the neck, and then the neck would meet the shoulder. And that's on both sides. And it's just one more data point, right? So, I started adding up. And that first night on Google Earth, after about an hour, I already had like 10 things that were lining up that actually matched with the idea, at least on a macro level, that this might actually be a creature. And I was like, 10 is a big number already. It shouldn't be that way. And I just want to say to those listening, if you feel called later, come back to our website and watch this episode, because these images are pretty profound to go along with what Mark is talking about. [Speaker 2] (1:06:01 - 1:06:01) Yeah. [Speaker 1] (1:06:02 - 1:06:05) Sorry. It is very visual for it. Because it's mostly audio. You're listeners, right? [Speaker 2] (1:06:06 - 1:06:06) Yeah. [Speaker 1] (1:06:06 - 1:11:57) It's all good. Yeah. Okay. It's all good, man. Yeah. So, a lot of people are presenting pictures like this. And my first thought when I started seeing these things is, this is pareidolia. And pareidolia is when you see a pattern that doesn't actually exist. You can see it in clouds. You can see it in wood grain. Oh, there's a little face there in that knot. And so, yeah, these might actually be petrified pieces or creatures, pieces of creatures or creatures themselves. Or it might just be pareidolia. Or some of them might be total manipulation. And even more recently, AI. So, you got to take everything you see with a grain of salt. And that's why work like what I've done on this subject is so important. Because I have so much boots on the ground footage. I've literally gone into the caves and I filmed them. I've taken microscopes to the stones. I've done so much beyond just being an armchair researcher that's looking at pictures and making claims about them. Like a lot of people will see something like this and boom, game over. That's a titan. There's the eye sockets. You can see it. But it might be if you looked at that from a different angle, it would look completely different. Sometimes people are looking at things and they're making conclusions based on foliage. Well, you can't include the foliage in your theory because that's very recent compared to a petrified titan. So, I took a step back because I knew that if you open your brain too much, your mind too much, your brain will fall out, right? And these were the problems that I saw early on with the researches. This pareidolia which I just described, photos from one angle, foliage, AI manipulation, a lot of point and claim. They're just like they see it and they're like, that's a bat. And it's like, yeah, maybe it is, maybe it isn't. Where's your evidence? And they have none. No on-site investigation, histological analysis, that's an actual study of the tissue. So, if there's any truth to what I was contemplating when it came to the mountain, like, okay, bone, what is the structure of bone? What do we know about bone? That's called histology when you dig into the structure of bone and that's what I started to do. And I started to look at that and go, does that compare with what I'm seeing on the ground here on the mountain and around the mountain? And it was just one thing after another. Just to give people an idea from a mathematical perspective, there are, with the mountain alone, there are over 50 different anatomical and histological features that I've documented. And I've documented all of those with photos and video. And that's a huge number. If you think about roll on the dice and games of chance, 50, like how many does it take before you open your mind to the possibility? Some people will never open their mind to the possibility no matter how much information they're presented with. But again, I thought it was a fun intellectual exercise. So, I took it further. I knew about the classic research pitfalls, which have to do with all of these things. Cherry picking is where it's like, oh, you're just picking out the things you want to pick out. Really? With 50 different, you know, features where I'm showing with photographs and video, you know, apophenia is like pareidolia, but this is the recognition of a pattern that doesn't exist. So, it's like, it's basically the same thing, but it's related to patterns. Dunning-Kruger, this is what I'm constantly accused of when it comes to geology is you don't know shit about the subject. You're not a geologist. You don't have a background in it. All that's true. But I talked about paradigm blindness before. If you're a geologist, you don't know anything about anatomy, what are the odds that you would start to recognize the pattern and start to contemplate it when everything you've been taught tells you it's not possible, right? But people who know a little bit about something, they think they know everything, and that's what the Dunning-Kruger effect is, is that they, you know, they don't realize that they don't really know what the heck they're talking about. A lot of people just know evidence for it. They just dismiss it. This is a stupid idea. And I won't go into these other things because they take too long to explain. So, my approach to it was very methodical analysis of aerial footage, looking at the correlations anatomically, microscopy. I did CAT scans on the heart stones, which if we have time, I'll go into at the end, endoscopy as well, which is, you know, getting in with cameras, going into the chambers of the stones. I went into the chambers of the mountain. There's the eye socket, and then you can crawl down this narrow passage, and it opens up into a bigger chamber behind that, which is interesting because behind our eye socket and below, which is exactly where I went in the cave, are our sinuses. So, you would expect there to be a cave there. There is a big cave. It's like one thing after another. So, that was my approach. And then this is when I started to look at the anatomical correlations. Now, it may not be an elephant. Bob Nodell of Globebusters, he described as a pachyderm. I didn't know that name. But basically, all these creatures like anteaters and different kinds of creatures that have trunks, you know, is it possible that it was one of those? Perhaps. I don't know. The shape of skulls change dramatically, but the bone structure of skulls is pretty much uniform across vertebrates, at least mammals. So, it could be one of a variety of different creatures. I do believe now that it's a creature. This hole right here, we have this as well, except for us, it's here. It's not here. It's called the infraorbital foramen. Can you see me when I'm gesturing on the screen? I don't know if I'm on screen. [Speaker 2] (1:11:57 - 1:11:57) Okay. [Speaker 1] (1:11:57 - 1:16:18) All right. Yeah. So, you can see here, we have it right here, this little hole, that's called the infraorbital foramen. Well, on elephants, it's over here. And if you tilt the head back, it would be in front of the, just like you see here, it would be pointing out. Well, guess what? There's the eye socket, and then there's another cave that's going exactly that direction. I'll show you what it looks like. That's right here in the next slide. So, there's the hole I'm talking about. Here, you can see it on Google Earth, and this is what it looks like looking through it. So, is this formed by tectonic activity, things jutting upward, and then like water erosion? The mountain is over 2,500 feet tall. So, that means the water had to be up really high for a long time to erode all this stuff. Like, how do these kinds of shapes come about? How old do you think that is, that mountain? When it comes to age, I have no idea. I definitely believe in a young Earth now. I'm a creationist. I'm not a Christian or necessarily a Bible believer, but I think there's a tremendous amount of truth in the Bible. Some people want to place the age of the Earth at like 6,000 years, I would never hazard a guess. I have no idea how old this place is. But again, I started to look into these things. Like, for example, if you look at the eye socket and all of these different bones where they meet, you can see the different colors. Right where the frontal bone meets the maxilla, there's a line there where those two join, and then that line goes back into the eye socket, and it looks like this. You can see that little line right there, right? Well, in the cave, that line is, where is it? Oh yeah, here. Look at this. It's exactly the same shape in exactly the same place. That's damn specific, right? And these are overlapping. They're not meeting each other. It's like they're two different structures that just happen to sit there like that. And that's exactly where the suture is. This I theorized early on was the remains of the eyeball. It's like a jutting, it comes upward, looks like a wave about to crash. So, if you think of the eyeball as having petrified but also burst, what would remain would be the big, thicker, fatty portion of the back side, and it would be shaped like a wave. So, this is the optic fissure in an elephant skull, and this is in the exact same place in the cave. And you can see it all here on the big scale. There's the suture I was talking about. This is the eye socket itself, and then the eye portion would jet upward like that. This is not the eye socket. That's the temporal muscle. It's right here. So, yeah. Did you believe in the existence of dinosaurs? I believe in the existence of large creatures. I'm far more on board with the former existence of dragons because all of our civilizations around the world describe great serpents in different ways. I think the dinosaur narrative is a hoax. I think that the bones that are being found, there's... I'm not going to go into that one. There are lots of videos that are touching on that subject. But I think one of the things that they've done is they've squirreled away the evidence for giants. And I think maybe some of what they're calling dinosaur skeletons might be just like mix and match of different bones of giant creatures, whether they're whales or mammoths or what have you. So, I think that's one to dig into, but I don't believe that dinosaurs are a thing. And I think that that's really to justify the heliocentric model and to justify our geological timelines, the timelines of the heliocentric model as well. And this whole idea of asteroids that could take us out, which becomes the justification for the space program. So, we got to pour billions and billions into space and exploration of space rather than feeding the poor and hungry here. Because if we don't, we might get hit by a rock that wipes out the entire species. And I think that's a load of bull. [Speaker 2] (1:16:20 - 1:16:30) Why does your view of biogeology... What is the connection between that and flat earth? Like, why can't that be a hypothesis in a heliocentric model? [Speaker 1] (1:16:32 - 1:19:03) Oh, it could. I haven't found evidence supporting the heliocentric model. Yeah. No, I mean, sure, why not? What doesn't make sense are creatures like the size of a thousand mile long dragon on a ball the size they tell us, which is 24,901 miles in circumference. And this thing would... If it just stood up, it would extend beyond the atmosphere. It doesn't make any sense. It's a silly idea in the heliocentric model. An infinite plane or something far, far larger than we were taught. Sure. And whether that was... Whether the thing in the Sahara is really a Titan, I don't know. I believe that the nature of reality is fractal, holographic, and that we are on one level and that a fractal level up from us would be something like the elephant. And then maybe a fractal level up from that would be something like this great leviathan behemoth kind of a thing. It's wild. In my mind, I'm trying to think about the size of this elephant and then what the birthing process was like, you know? How big was it when it was just like a giant, you know what I mean? Like sexual organ from its mother. And then how was it birthed? This like mile-long elephant. My last video was called AI Lies, Petrified Coochies, and due diligence. I think all of us really need to be doing our due diligence when it comes to these kinds of things. So many people are perfectly fine with jumping on board with whatever theory comes their way, but they don't really dig into things and find out if it has any merit. And then they start perpetuating lies because they think it does, but they really don't know. So the AI lies is really important because now we can't trust our eyes with anything digital online. It's so sophisticated now that you go on Instagram, 90% of people can't discern between something that's computer generated and something that's real anymore. And if you put them in through the AI detectors, which most people will never do, you find vast variations of results based on that. Am I still sharing screen or is it? [Speaker 3] (1:19:03 - 1:19:06) No, you're not sharing screen. Do you not see us? [Speaker 1] (1:19:06 - 1:39:27) Yeah, I see you now. I just wasn't sure if people were staring at whatever I had on the screen. You can keep going with what you were saying, but before we end, I definitely want to get into the heart stones and the boiled egg theory, because I think that kind of explains how tissue can petrify. I mean, I know you explain it in more detail, but... Yeah. So I put out a question to God, the universe, like, hey, if there's any truth to this mud fossil thing, send me an example that's undeniable, because I was watching videos and I'm like, there might be something to it, but it's a little farfetched and it's being overapplied. And there was a lot of pointing to nondescript rocks and making claims about them. And I had a real problem with that because they would say, it's absolutely this. And I was like, yeah, well, it might be something else. And you turn it over, you might see something entirely different in it. If you look at my artwork back here, it's very abstract. If I turn it 90 degrees or 180 degrees, people see faces and different things, but you turn it, you see something entirely different. So you've got to exercise discernment when it comes to these things and understand how easy it is to be fooled. And so a few days later, I found this rock that was... I picked it up and I'm like, what in the heck? This looks like a heart. And the more I looked at it, the more I could show... I can show it here. The more I looked at it, the more I defined all kinds of anatomical features that were... There we go. This is the backside and this is the front side. So this stone is how it all began with the heart stones. I started... You can see this, this is called the isthmus. That's what's being pictured over here. This is the aorta and the vena cava. These are my theories. I'm not presenting this as indisputable fact, but the heart is in a fatty sack called the pericardium. This ties into the boiled egg theory. And so if this were indeed a petrified heart, I would expect the outside to be white. And then anywhere that that outer portion of the stone had worn away, removing that fatty layer, then the inside would be fleshy. And that's exactly what you see. If you put this underwater, it looks like a hunk of meat. And right where it should be, there's this hole, which is where the coronary artery would come out. And then right along here is an indentation for what's known as the coronary sulcus, which is the coronary artery follows that line. So this is your left atrium, your left ventricle. These are incredibly specific anatomical features. Then I went in with an endoscopic camera. I believe that these lumps here are the remains of what are known as the papillary muscles, which are the muscles that contract and open the valves. So as I started to tally up a number of different features, and compare it to actual hearts of different species, because the hearts vary dramatically in their morphology, but they don't vary in their anatomy. There are slight variations. There's three chamber hearts, there's four chamber hearts. But in general, they all are following the same kinds of things. You see this line here, this is known as a sulcus, here and here. This is a giraffe heart, long and narrow, kind of like a giraffe. This is an elephant heart, which is big and globular, right? Globular. So they take on a lot of different shapes. So I made a video called my fossils, the hard matter. I mapped out all of the different things that I was finding in this stone, and went in with endoscopic camera. And I just started thinking about the scientific method because I made this observation. Your urine presents a view, by the way, so the screen's a bit smaller. Oh, how do I change that? I wonder. Yeah, I'm not sure. So good. I don't even know. Ah, sorry. All good. Right there. Is that better? No, no, it's still... Oh, yes, that's better. That's better. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So, you know, the scientific method, you make observations, you think of interesting questions, you formulate a hypothesis, and then you go out and you develop testable predictions, and you go out and try and see if those match your expectations. And that's exactly what I did. I thought, is this a petrified heart? If it is, it shouldn't be standalone, I should be able to find others. And I hadn't yet formulated a hypothesis about the how, which I call boiled egg theory. But I did go out and I started to look for more. So I went out into the field, and I started to find a whole bunch of stones that match these same kinds of features. And some people would say that I'm cherry picking. And that's true, because I'm not picking up the stones that look nothing like a heart, I'm looking at the ones that look like a heart. But the question is, are there a lot of anatomical features that are very specific? And that's when I started to recognize that there is a reoccurring pattern in stones that shouldn't be there, if what they're telling us about tectonic activity, and stones breaking off into different pieces, and then rolling around and getting beaten up is true. And this is a very, very specific feature, not feature, but pattern that I started to recognize. And many of these stones, that's the first one I found, this one is a foot and a half in size. So that would be, you know, a foot and a half, an elephant's heart isn't that big. So this is a creature bigger than an elephant, perhaps a mammoth, but I'm finding them like tiny little ones. So rodents, humans, cows, all of these creatures have different size hearts, but I'm finding the same pattern, you know, in a very specific fashion, across scale. I went into the field, I started breaking them up, and looking at the insides, and a lot of them are very meaty inside. I went and had them CAT scanned, and found that, you know, you've got these chambers inside here, here I'm going with an endoscopic camera. And all that bumpiness, you would expect if that was water erosion, all these bumps here, you would think that that would erode away, but that is identical to what's known as trabecular carne, which is what the inside of the heart looks like. You have this bumpy quality to the heart. So back out into the field, sliced them open, polished them, and when I polished them up, here's, you know, here's an example of... So I started to recognize that there's these telltale key features that are highly specific, and you've got the sulcus lines, you have at the top this indentation or opening where the aorta and the vena cava would have been, which are the biggest blood vessels in the body, the twisting of the heart as the heart contracts. I'll show a little one-minute video in a moment that really shows, you know, why these things are occurring in the stones, if I'm correct about this theory. But I still didn't understand, like, and a lot of people have probably already asked themselves, if this is true, why would the hearts be found intact, complete, completely separate from the body? You know, it's... I was asking that same question early on, even with the very first one I found, like, what the heck? Here you can see when you wet them, you know, a lot of it will just start to become very fleshy. That one, you can see, has a fracture in it, and look how dark it is on the inside, but it's lighter on the outside. Some would say that's because it's oxidized, or maybe it's because there's a pericardium, which is the fatty layer that surrounds the body. The fatty layer of the pericardium is the thickest of the layers that cover the organs, and it's also flexible and expansive, so this gets into boiled egg theory. My understanding early on was, if this is true, and these are organs, then the outer portion of the body had to have been destroyed in order for this to be true. How it was destroyed, I don't know. Plasma, volcanic activity, extremely high heat, you know, there were things I didn't know anything about at that point, like bog bodies, which I might have time to talk about, but basically my theory was this. If you think of a boiled egg, you start with a shell, you start with liquid inside, you boil it for six to ten minutes, and you have varying degrees of hardness. If you boil it too much, the shell cracks, and it gets really hard, and you don't want to eat it. Well, if that shell had been flexible and didn't crack, and you kept boiling it, or better yet, you put it under pressure in a crock pot, which speeds up the cooking time, and it makes the heat more intense, then how hard would that egg get? And that was when I started thinking that maybe the outer portions of the body are being destroyed. Perhaps there's pressure involved, if we think of things like mud floods, and the bodies are coming under a lot of pressure, and then that would harden these, and then as the outer portions of the body are eroded and destroyed, maybe paramineralization, that mud fossil process I talked about in the beginning, might take over and complete the process and turn them completely to stone, or maybe this is happening instantaneously. I don't know. My suspicions nowadays are that it's more of an instantaneous thing, could happen in hours, it could happen in seconds. There's an example in Canada of power lines that went down, and they laid across a line of tree trunks, trees that had been cut down, and within six hours of the current continuing to run through the lines without shorting out, those tree trunks turned to stone, and then the root structures were also stone. That's a short amount of time for petrification. So, like I said before, I think all things that are fat, and that includes blood itself, because blood is made of these long chain fatty acids, the plasma in blood, you can see it here. I think all things fat, when they're petrified, they petrify into different kinds of quartz. So, that's the boiled egg theory in a nutshell. Where did the bones go? I didn't think about it, but we have bone broth as an example of how they could have dissolved. If you take bones and you put them inside of a crock pot, in a matter of, let's see, I used to have a video there. No, I'm not showing it. This is just describing artificial petrification, but in a matter of 24 hours on mild heat in a crock pot, those bones will cook down to sponge, and then eventually become a gelatin, and then when that gelatin cools, it hardens again. So, there are a lot of different possibilities. I think that there's an unlimited number of possibilities, depending on the tissue, depending on how things are petrified, depending on how long it took for it to occur, what was mixed in with it. So, it's difficult to have any kind of a blanket conclusion about this sort of stuff. These are bog bodies. This is a really interesting phenomenon where they fall into these peat bogs, which I think are, I can't remember if they're highly acidic or they're highly base, but basically what happens is over the course of time, the bones inside completely dissolve, and you have this sack, which is the outer skin of the body, and all of the organs harden. That sounds like boiled egg theory, kind of, right? It's just another thing that I found out about in the last year that I didn't even know about until I began looking into all these things. This is the Mother Shipton's cave that I mentioned before, and Lake Natron where these creatures fall in and they don't come out. So, I just want to share the work of this man because this I found out about after I started on this journey. Someone said to me, the heart is a rope in one of my comments, and I didn't know what they meant, and it took another person to mention it, and then they put the helical heart. So, I went looking and I found a documentary about this man's life and was utterly blown away. He was the discoverer of what's known as the myocardioventricular band. What he discovered is that the heart is like rolled into a knot, and for hundreds and hundreds of years, people were trying to understand how it worked, and we have all these models that are taught to cardiologists today that are completely erroneous because they don't understand the basic fundamental nature of the anatomy of the heart, and he cracked the nut on it. And so, what he does, this is just a little one-minute video on his life. His name is Francisco Torrens Guaspe. Yeah, Paco is his nickname. So, this is just a one-minute video I made to summarize this discovery that was so monumental that he made. Did you know that almost everything you were taught about the heart is wrong? Most everyone today, even doctors, still believe the heart to be a four-chamber pump that pushes blood through a mind-boggling 60,000 miles of narrowing blood vessels to fuel our 40 trillion cells, then filling again as if by magic on relaxation. Well, that theory was thoroughly debunked by the Spanish cardiologist Francisco Torrens Guaspe back in 1972. After dissecting thousands of hearts, Guaspe finally discovered the heart's true structure. The heart's far more amazing than we ever knew. It's like a rope, a long tube wrapped into a knot. Instead of being pushed, the blood is pulled through the heart in two spiraling vortexes. This has been proven with CAT scans, functional MRI, and positronic emission. Look at the spiraling contraction. It changes everything we know about the heart and circulation. If you'd like to know more, check out these videos. Yeah, so I went to school to be a chiropractor. I studied the heart anatomy in depth and I knew nothing about that. And it was, you know, it brought goosebumps. Every time I have goosebumps right now just thinking about it. It's monumental and it took, science had to evolve for them to prove his theories about blood flow as well. Because the reason he made this discovery is because he didn't buy the official narrative, which is that the heart is pumping blood out when it contracts, that it's pushing the blood in these narrowing blood vessels down to the capillaries. It's stopping entirely. And then it's turning around and going the other direction. And then it's filling into the heart passively with the help of a little bit of valves that close and muscular contraction of the legs. But how does that work in somebody who's wheelchair bound? They don't have that action, right? And yet all this blood just magically makes it back after being pushed out. And he's like, that doesn't make any sense to me whatsoever. And so he started dissecting hearts, thousands of hearts. He did this over many years before he finally figured out how to do it by boiling the heart, removing the outer fatty layer. He was able, like you saw in the video, to just using his fingers, unravel this thing in one long straight tube. And that discovery should have earned him a Nobel prize. And then his theories about blood flow should also have earned him a Nobel prize because those were also proven to be true. And this stuff is still not being taught to cardiologists. They might hear a mention of his name, but they're still teaching this four-chamber pump model. And guys who are cutting into hearts don't even know the true anatomy of the heart. I was gobsmacked. And as I saw that, there's a point in the video where it's showing the contraction of the heart and the heart muscle fibers themselves are spiral. So if you look at it from the bottom, it does this twisting motion like a propeller. And so they've done CAT scans where they took a cow's heart, and you can see it in the video as well, and they blow it up with gas. And they're doing CAT scans, which are basically like these sliver x-rays as they're expanding it. And then as it contracts, and you can see that the heart muscle itself has these dual rotating opposite spiraling vortex in the heart muscle. And that's also how the blood is flowing. And they were able to prove that the blood was doing that through positronic emission, which is, that's the upper portion in that video, where they're basically, I think it's radioactive stuff that they put into the bloodstream, and then they're able to watch the movement of the fluids. So it's been proven unequivocally, but it's still like most people had... I mean, all of us grew up learning about the heart. How many of us grew up learning about that? None. And it's been known for like 30 years. And so there's been so many crazy synchronistic events that have accompanied my exploration into all of these topics. And one of the biggest synchronicities of all was after I learned about this, I was watching that documentary on his life, and I got to the end of the documentary, I saw that he lived and worked his whole career in a place called Denia, Spain. And Denia is at the foothill of Montgau. Wow. So this man literally lived on the mountain that I had already been making videos about before I discovered this heartstone and started making videos about those before I knew anything. He lived and worked his whole career on the foothills of Montgau. Like, what are the odds of something like that? It's just like... It's wild. Those little nods and wings from universe when things come together like that, and the different ways that information comes to you, then that recognition that's all happening in the same place, like stuff like that is... Yeah. Yeah. I've done entire videos. There's one video I did, it's a live stream called Synchronicity Stream. And I just tell the stories of the crazy synchronicities that have happened through these investigations. It's been a reoccurring theme. And I've shared that story each step of the way. Because for me, this was just a fun intellectual exercise. I didn't have an agenda. I wasn't trying to capitalize on it. People are like, well, where do we send people for your stuff? It's like, I just have a YouTube channel, which originally wasn't even monetized for the first couple of years. The only reason I monetized it was because Google was about to change their algorithms. And they specifically said in their, in their, what do you call it, bylaws, their terms and conditions, that they were going to be emphasizing content that was financially lucrative for them. I thought, oh, that's a very clever way for them to basically steer people away from truth or content, especially if it's not monetized. Well, we're not gonna make any money on that. So why are we gonna put that in people's feeds? So that was why I originally started to monetize it. And people are like, oh yeah, you're out there trying to make money. I'm like, I've averaged less than a dollar an hour for my time spent on this since I've been doing it. And I do have a book that will eventually be out, but that's 35 years in the making. Who knows? Hopefully I'll get to it this year. You don't need to justify receiving value for your hard work, your effort, your research at all, man. Thank you. Thank you. I'm just, I'm just letting people know that it's like, there is no, you know, I've had, I have had some delusions in my life. Huge, huge blind spot and shadow spot of the quote unquote truth of community is when it comes to, you know, their relationship when it comes to money and value for sure. Prosperity. [Speaker 3] (1:39:27 - 1:39:27) Yeah, that's right. [Speaker 1] (1:39:28 - 1:39:47) Yeah. You support what you love or it goes away. You know, it's like, why do people, where do they get the stupid idea that people should just be pouring their life, blood and heart and soul into content that they're consuming and that they shouldn't be rewarded in some way for it? It's like, it's the ultimate poverty consciousness. [Speaker 2] (1:39:48 - 1:39:52) Yeah. And to me, like, you know, communism isn't something that's gone away. [Speaker 1] (1:39:52 - 1:41:48) It's a perfect vessel to continue to run psyops and keep people under certain illusions, which keeps them from arms linked from potential and prosperity and really, you know, being alive in the miracle of what it means to be a human being. Yeah. And I think it's just so important to go with where your imagination takes you and tell these stories because, you know, you bring up this guy Paco, I don't know his full name, but I just remember Paco. And it's like, these are like, in a lot of ways, forgotten heroes, you know, and how many of those exist? You know, when I think about the people that I've come across, you know, some of the research I've come across, I'm like, I've never even heard of this guy, you know, and then you have people who kind of like take other people's ideas and pawn them off as their own and they don't give credit to like the source material, you know, I'm not even I have. Sorry to interrupt. No, I was going to say earlier, like, you know, you went to school, you know, we study these things and we never hear about these people, you know, like for me as someone who's like a novice student of even Dr. Homer's work in Germany medicine, I go like, man, this is this discovery of biological laws, like 30, 40 years ago. And yet, you know, how many people know about this stuff or at least are curious enough to explore it? So, you know, this is what I love about technology. This is what I love about like individuals who want to go down these rabbit holes and explore them and express them. And I think people should be able to receive value for the blood, sweat and tears they put into this stuff, man. If it wasn't for my open-mindedness to some crazy idea like flat earth, I would never have come across the works of Victor Schauberger, Walter Russell, Victor Grabenikov, you know, there are all of these luminaries that are from our past that gave volumes and volumes of incredible information that was dismissed as pseudoscience in favor of pseudoscience. [Speaker 2] (1:41:49 - 1:42:01) And being able to like, and being able to accommodate for the contradictions along the path, because I mean, in Walter Russell's cosmology, that really doesn't lead one to a flat earth path either, right? But, and there's value in how you've gotten there. [Speaker 1] (1:42:02 - 1:48:18) Yeah. Yeah. It's definitely couched in the heliocentric model. I suspect if he were alive today, he would, he would, might've, you know, been flat earther. Ultimately, I'm not a flat earther. I think it's a false dichotomy. I think it's, it's there to get people arguing amongst each other. You're a globetard. You're a flatard. It's like, no, it's flat. No, it's, you know, no, I think, I think the truth of our realm is far beyond what we're capable of really understanding and we can't get outside of it. So nobody really knows the true shape of it. And I think ultimately it's probably something akin to what we're seeing in the heart with the vortex natural nature of the heart, because that comes back to sonoluminescence, plasma physics, cymatics, all of these different things dovetail perfectly with each other. And they shouldn't, if they were just, you know, crazy ideas. And, and so I lean towards the toroid. I think that's the master shape. I think it explains so much, if not everything of what we experience here in the realm and what we're perceiving empirically when we do our different, you know, experiments and observations. And, you know, that, that basically is the synthesis of the globe model and the flat earth model. And, hmm, interesting. It also matches perfectly with the ancient cosmological models that all of the different societies around the world gave us. So the thing is to stay curious and to stay open and to check yourself when self-righteousness, arrogance, and this need for certainty and to present that certainty to the world. You know what I mean? It's like, you know, speak your mind, speak your beliefs. And then sometimes, Hey, but I, I'm not, I'm not 100% sure on this. That's very different than like, this is the shape of the earth. No, like, you know, it's just, again, this is where like, how do we communicate, you know, how do we foster this curiosity and then communicate that in a way where people go, Oh, that's, that's interesting. You know what I mean? And I think that's, that's, what's missing a lot. I think from, from art, from what the community I have been using that word, right? Like individuals that like question certain aspects of the world about reality that like the status quo, whatever that is, you know, that's, that's, that's much more concise. Community, truther, all of these are loaded charge words that, you know, it's like, it's not really community. There's so much infighting, so many people calling each other out. And, you know, truther implies that we have, we're the arbiters of truth. We've awakened and you're asleep. And it's like, it's, it's a never ending awakening process. And also check yourself before you wreck yourself. That's what I'm saying, man. You think, you think the, like, whatever the other side that maybe certain people judge, you think they're sitting there and going, well, I'm part of the liar community. You know what I mean? Like, like, like thinking they're like, if they were familiar with the truther, they're like, I'm a truther. Biden's a great president. He's one of the best presidents we've had in a long time. I'm speaking truth. You know, like, so again, these labels and it's a trippy world. I'm here for the illusions. But again, I think being here for the truth is to be able to hold the tension of opposites, is to be able to be curious about the different sides of knowing the, the argument of the person that you're challenging and vice versa, you know, and being able to sit there and communicate it without resorting to ad hominem attacks, you know, and insults and complete dismissal, you know, and this is why I think like, you know, the real work is inner work, man. The real truth is exploring internally and taking care of yourself and regulating your nervous system and, and building the capacity to have dialogue with individuals. Even when you feel a discomfort coming up of like, oh no, I'm right. They're wrong. But then being able to still handle it and function, you know what I mean? Like, and, and that's what I'm fascinated by is just observing the, the interactions between individuals and their communication styles and, and how people are just so certain that they're right and everyone else is a fucking idiot, you know? Yeah. Polarity has been weaponized against us. You know, when I was a kid, you know, people prided themselves on me. Like I can, I'm a Christian, but I, I got friends who are Muslims, Muslims, you know, that, that I'm not, I'm not, I'm saying that that's something that, that someone else would have been proud of their ability to like, we don't have the same faith or religion, but we can be friends and we can discuss things together without getting triggered. And it's like, that's a lost art. Like, I feel like an old fogey now because like it's anything but that nowadays. It's like, it's all, it's all about pitting us against each other. That's where, you know, understanding power structures and divide and conquer strategies and all that stuff is super important. Well, even just, you know, these last 90 plus minutes, man, just hearing you share your knowledge. You're not like, my name's Mike Wilkerson, stellium seven, and I'm right. And everyone's wrong. Like you propose some really interesting things, but then there's also that, like, Hey, you know, like, I, I'm, I'm not, you know, these are my observations based on my research and the data points I've taken in. And ultimately, like for anyone listening, if you're curious about this stuff, like, you know, go to go to go follow him on, on YouTube and explore this stuff even more. And then maybe go out into your environment and you live by mountain, go there and maybe look for some heartstones and go, Whoa, this looks like exactly like the thing that Mike showed on here for the podcast. Like stay curious, you know, don't accept anything. I've had so many people send me them around the world. They've done exactly that. And sometimes the, the, the photos they've sent me, I'm like, wow, that's an amazing one. That's, you know, the ones I get here are often they're very white. They've like, they've been, they've been affected by the elements and, and you know, but sometimes they look like they're practically still dripping with blood, you know, it's wild. [Speaker 3] (1:48:18 - 1:48:18) Yeah. [Speaker 1] (1:48:18 - 1:48:28) Anyways, man, thank you so much. I know we can talk for hours on all sorts of topics. Well, we're going to do that soon, right? You and I, anyway, are you going to be there as well, Joel, in Music in the Sky? [Speaker 2] (1:48:28 - 1:48:33) Yeah, man. I'll be there. I'm performing in my unreleased album and I'll be hosting a live podcast. [Speaker 1] (1:48:33 - 1:48:35) Oh, you're a musician. Yeah. [Speaker 2] (1:48:35 - 1:48:38) I'll be hosting a live podcast with Erasmus and Alec as well. [Speaker 1] (1:48:39 - 1:52:48) This is awesome. I knew about your podcast. I haven't had a chance to see, but I went through and I looked and I, there's like 30 different people that are, people that I, that I love, that I've, whose work that I've listened to, you've, you've talked with. So I'm like, oh yeah, this is, this is going to be fun. But I don't, I, I, you know, don't really know much about either one of you. So. No worries, man. We know each other better than in California. You do know that that's my, well, you would call it destiny card. You know, we did talk about that for like maybe 10 minutes in Mexico. But real quickly, I know, like we've mentioned it, but like, how could people support you? How could people like dive into your work even more? I think you have. Well, as far as support goes, normally I don't ask for any support, but I am doing this trip that's going to involve music and Sky. And then after that, I'm going to Colorado to, to, to stay with a guy named Hangman. His channel is Hangman1128. If you want, like undeniable proof of the existence of the great trees, this guy's got it in HD and 4k on site with zoom showing you all kinds of different structures. And you just have to ask yourself over and over again, if that's not tree, how could that have come to be? Because it doesn't make any sense in the mainstream model. And it mirrors everything we know about trees and how they break down and how they decay and how they petrify in every single way on a scale that is beyond imagining. So I've been a fan of his work for a good four years or so. I've done many videos on the subject of the big trees. I never would have done that if it hadn't been for his work, because that was when I realized that, yeah, the stumps are one thing, but that's not the most compelling evidence. There is so many data points and I didn't get to them in this conversation. These are, you know, really to cover this, to do this topic justice takes four hours, but I'm going to be meeting with him in Colorado. We're going to go to South Dakota. We're going to go to some of these sites, hopefully devil's tower, because we're going to be about right where our hotel is. It's going to be about an hour from there. So I'd like to see that with my own eyes and walk around it and form an opinion based on firsthand experience. Um, but, uh, that's going to be expensive. I'm missing a lot of work time. So if people do want to support me, uh, I have a PayPal. It's, it's, uh, my channel name at hotmail.com. Um, I don't have any other products to sell or offer the YouTube channel is, uh, where I would send people just to see the material. And, um, you know, let me comment because I, you know, I've been algorithm to death. I shot up to like 18,000 really quick. And, uh, and now it's, it, it's been hovering at 27 for like a year. I put out a ton of content. I've got the highest view counts I've ever had overwhelming lights and, uh, very few comments and very, um, very few new subs. Not, not that I'm complaining. It's just the nature of the game, but, uh, it's nice to people check in and just let me know because, um, a lot of people are watching, but there's not much activity or action on the channel. And I don't think that's by accident. There's a video, the fifth unveiling a Titan video, uh, shows that they censored the mountain on Google earth. I showed the before and afters after I started making videos on the mountain, the eye and the ear got blocked. You can't see those clearly. And I use, I used all of that Google earth footage. I would zoom in really slow from a distance so I could get it from all kinds of different angles. And I use that footage extensively in the first videos. And after about the fourth video, couldn't do that anymore. Check out the fifth video. If you think I'm lying, you'll see that, that that's no, that, that looks like it was done by hand and it doesn't look like an accident. So I call it send sorcery ship. And thank you so much for hanging out. We'll put those links in the show notes. [Speaker 2] (1:52:48 - 1:52:53) Uh, appreciate you. Appreciate you sharing your knowledge. Everyone else. Thank you for listening. And we'll see you next time.